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iQuABoB
11-26-2002, 03:46 PM
I know hicas is 4 wheel steering, and i test drove one with this feature... it was pretty cool doing a u-turn with it... but im interested in learning drifting and other techniques so i dont think i want 4WS...

So i have a couple questions?
First I was wondering how to tell if a car has HICAS?
and
Second I was wondering if most cars in Canada come with HICAS?

mrmephistopheles
11-26-2002, 10:17 PM
First question:
1. check the VIN plate inside the engine bay. The chassis code will be RMKS13 (the car has to be a fastback, 91-93)
2. check for a HICAS dummy light in the gauge cluster
3. in the black stripe along the side of the car, just behind the door it will read 'SUPER HICAS'
4. get under the car and check the differential. If you see a cylinder with two arms coming out going to each rear wheel, it's HICAS.

Second question:
This was a myth perpetrated by an email list and furthered by MANY users. No. Also, even if you find a perfect car, except that it has HICAS, remember that you CAN disable it.

Edit: I was slightly off about the chassis code. It's now corrected.

Kevin

iQuABoB
11-27-2002, 01:36 PM
how can you disable it and isnt it going to cost more to fix if you damage the rear suspension while drifting?

mrmephistopheles
12-04-2002, 12:44 AM
Disable? Pull a fuse, or if you really want to be thorough, yank out the whole system.
Yes, it will be expensive to fix, as the parts are only going to come from Nissan. It's not like a shock you can blow or a wheel you can bend and get aftermarket replacement parts. You MAY be able to find rebuilt parts, but good luck.

nrcooled
12-04-2002, 05:46 AM
There are HICAS eliminator kits you just have to have a overseas hook up to get it.  It's not widely sold in the US.  

But if you want to do it your self here is the trick

1. Have a shop fab up a straight rod to go between the "steering rack" in the ass end just to make sure that the rear tires don't move or shift position

2. Loop the steering lines that run to the rear so you will keep pressure (looking at you engine bay they will be on the far left at the very bottom)

3. Voila! your done and you get to keep the LSD (which you would probally have to remove when putting in a non HICAS rear end).  FYI your HICAS light will come on

mrmephistopheles
12-04-2002, 07:31 AM
</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (nrcooled @ Dec. 04 2002,04:46)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">3. Voila! your done and you get to keep the LSD (which you would probally have to remove when putting in a non HICAS rear end). FYI your HICAS light will come on</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
You could keep the LSD regardless. The HICAS unit is placed at the upper rear portion of the differential, but is by no means integral with it.

SHINCHU
12-05-2002, 02:33 PM
yeah i have HICAS and its a pain in the rear! get it? pain in... nevermind. im eventually going to the junkyards and pulling the whole rear from a non-hicas 240 and swap it all in while keeping the LSD. hopefully it will be pretty straightforward. only reason im doing it (besides the fact hicas makes it hard to drift) is so i can run aftermarket shocks in the rear. the arms that steer the rear wheels actually attatch to the shocks and use them to steer. way to go nissan! that sucks. at least this is what i gather from all the things i have heard. HICAS. what a nightmare for people that know how to tune cars and drive them without aid of computer controls.

im thinking of putting some nice bushings in all the new rear pieces while they are off. seems like the logical thing to do. and what are those spacers that go between the rear end and the chassis? uras monkey magic of japan calls these "drift pineapples". i suppose it gives the suspension a better angle for drifting? how does this work? where can i get a good set to try out? thanks for any help.

chris

Dousan_PG
12-05-2002, 02:42 PM
shinshu180sx is right. hicas and drifting are harder. the car is trying to correct itself while you are trying to keep traction away in the rear..doesnt work well

you can do the subframe swap of course. there are also hicas cancelling bars (a lot of Japanese companies make them, one is Kazama that comes to mind)

also those MOnkey Magic Drift Pineapples are VERY available stateside. if you buy the monkey magic one your paying for the name. i got ones from Greg Dupree (there were group buys on them). they are subframe spacers. basically the compress the subframe so elimiate slop (which helps reduce wheel hope)
BUT for you shinshu180sx, since you are replacing the entier subframe, the monkey magic one (the bigger kit-like 8 piece-not the 4 piece) you should get. you can also get the Whiteline Kit which is the SAME thing!! so be careful on the brand you want. just because its japanese doesnt make it any better then the exact same product stateside (specifically espcially something so simple as these drift pineapples!!<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>

anyways, hope that helps.

RYNO_s13
12-06-2002, 03:53 PM
I believe that Jim Wolf Technology has a disabler for the HICAS. you can get the phone # at www.jimwolftechnology.com

SHINCHU
12-08-2002, 08:48 PM
thanks dousan and ryno.
i know there are other companies that make the spacers, but i just thought "drift pineapples" would be a more easily recognized name for them. i guess i was right! haha

so yeah i think the whiteline stuff sounds pretty good. doesnt PDM carry a lot of thier stuff? i might as well get the whole bushing kit for the back since i will have all the pieces off the car and i might powdercoat them some nifty color while im at it. wow when i get everything on i bet the alignment shop will hate me! "man, what did you do to this thing?! its WAY off!!" haha

as for the elimination kit, i think i would just get rid of the system all together to save wieght. i mean, the pump itself has to wiegh like what, 20 lbs? yeah, its outta there. but i will look into the elimintation kit since jim wolf is right up the street from me (well like 30 min.).
thanks for the input!

chris

SHINCHU
12-08-2002, 08:48 PM
thanks dousan and ryno.
i know there are other companies that make the spacers, but i just thought "drift pineapples" would be a more easily recognized name for them. i guess i was right! haha

so yeah i think the whiteline stuff sounds pretty good. doesnt PDM carry a lot of thier stuff? i might as well get the whole bushing kit for the back since i will have all the pieces off the car and i might powdercoat them some nifty color while im at it. wow when i get everything on i bet the alignment shop will hate me! "man, what did you do to this thing?! its WAY off!!" haha

as for the elimination kit, i think i would just get rid of the system all together to save wieght. i mean, the pump itself has to wiegh like what, 20 lbs? yeah, its outta there. but i will look into the elimintation kit since jim wolf is right up the street from me (well like 30 min.).
thanks for the input!

chris

mods: heheh sorry about the double post. sucks posting from an aircraft carrier. sssslllloooowwwwwwww...

KoukiS14
12-22-2002, 02:38 PM
Why would you want to get rid of it? How does it screw up drifting? All mine did was help everything. The stock handling on S14 is very disappointing. . Got so used to HICAS.

Drifting (not saying I'm a pro) was very easy with it, it never got in the way. I guess I don't understand the mentality of wanting to throw a gift away haha

-Rob

transient
12-22-2002, 05:34 PM
Originally posted by Shinchu180sx
the arms that steer the rear wheels actually attatch to the shocks and use them to steer. way to go nissan

Are you absolutely sure that it's impossible to use aftermarket shocks with HICAS? Seems like a pretty big engineering problem if that's really the case...

RomperStomper
03-07-2003, 07:48 AM
i have hicas with Koni Adjustables and Eibach pro-kit springs and they installed no problem

AKADriver
03-07-2003, 09:09 AM
Yes, the "aftermarket struts won't fit HICAS" is a myth perpetuated by manufacturers of the shocks that don't correctly read the factory parts lists. The HICAS cars had struts with more aggressive damping from the factory, and hence a different part number; but they bolt up just the same.

Dousan_PG
03-07-2003, 09:12 AM
Originally posted by KoukiS14
Why would you want to get rid of it? How does it screw up drifting? All mine did was help everything. The stock handling on S14 is very disappointing. . Got so used to HICAS.

Drifting (not saying I'm a pro) was very easy with it, it never got in the way. I guess I don't understand the mentality of wanting to throw a gift away haha

-Rob

because the car is contantly trying to correct itself wen you go sideways

if you tried a s13 w/o hicas you probably would have noticed the difference.

maybe it was the speed you were going?

KoukiS14
03-07-2003, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by dousan36
because the car is contantly trying to correct itself wen you go sideways

if you tried a s13 w/o hicas you probably would have noticed the difference.

maybe it was the speed you were going?

Not sure, I've done it at speeds ranging from 30 mph to 60 mph, and noticed no ill effects...

I've driven a couple of S13s without it, handling feels as bad as it does in my S14. . (of course, HICAS is a complete system and not just rear wheel steering tho. . )

Dousan_PG
03-07-2003, 12:11 PM
interesting...
my s13 is so nimble its ridiculous. i drove a friend's (2) s14s and it was like driving a boat crazy

my car's stable at high speeds (60ish+) drifting. but i'd like to try a hicas one one day. just to see what its about. of course one slide isnt enough, gotta chokudori it and see how it goes. maybe 3 consecutive corners might see the downsides of it.

KoukiS14
03-07-2003, 07:45 PM
Originally posted by dousan36
interesting...
my s13 is so nimble its ridiculous. i drove a friend's (2) s14s and it was like driving a boat crazy

my car's stable at high speeds (60ish+) drifting. but i'd like to try a hicas one one day. just to see what its about. of course one slide isnt enough, gotta chokudori it and see how it goes. maybe 3 consecutive corners might see the downsides of it.

Yeah, HICAS > S13 > S14. .
S14 is the worst of the bunch, took me awhile to learn how to control it. . springs will fix that. . haha. . . ugh. .

Oh well. . .

Yeah u need to drive one!!! you might like it. . :)

Everyone says it's invasive and twitchy, but. . I disagree. . nothing like .95 G STOCK on H rated all season tires!!!
compare that to .88 G with S14. .

misnomer
03-08-2003, 02:57 PM
**** dood, I feel like I'm one of the only guys who would trade up to HICAS in a heartbeat. . . :P

And here everybody is trying to kill it.

AKADriver
03-08-2003, 03:28 PM
Well, they're looking to drift.

KoukiS14
03-08-2003, 08:53 PM
Originally posted by misnomer
**** dood, I feel like I'm one of the only guys who would trade up to HICAS in a heartbeat. . . :P

And here everybody is trying to kill it.

I know!! And they sell kits to DEFEAT it for the track. Although, I have to admit. . I don't race on the track, so I can't say it's worth defeating for the track. All I can say is, people spend way too much time prepping their street cars for the track, when most of us never (or rarely) go there.
For the street, keep the HICAS... it's a hell of a cool thing, IMO. . Plus, you get VLSD, stiffer stock springs and thicker stock sways (which most people replace anyway haha, but still...) and you get a tighter ratio front steering box. . All adds up for some impressive feel, and amazing handling. . Don't get me wrong, my S14 handles okay, but it's total ASS compared to my HICAS S13, and I knew what I was up against b4 I bought it. . (and I'd make the decision again) fresher, newer S14 > rusting 140k mile S13. .

SHINCHU
03-08-2003, 11:22 PM
***UPDATE***

okay i drifted the **** out of my hicas s13 at drift showoff and it felt fine. aaron if you wanna try a hicas car next event i go to you can try mine. if i can try yours mwahahaha! j/k nah you can try mine though its all good. so anyway, maybe hicas isnt so bad. its hard to break loose initially, but once its sideways, there's no stoppin ya! and i only spun out twice all day! heheh. and as for the shocks, i was thinking of just ordering some more agx (i already have fronts mounted) and just see if they fit. the more i think about it, its obsurd that nissan would make a car you cant replace shocks on. that was rather ignorant of me. other things get on my nerves though. the biggest thing is that i cant get an aftermarket steering wheel because the hub and entire steering shaft are different on a hicas car because there are steering angle sensors they had to change everything for, and nobody has made a hub adapter yet for that design. and i was having serious leg clearance issues at drift showoff. i have to heel-toe with the side of my foot instead of my heel. it sucks.

new question: how low can you go on AGX? i'm about to mount some adjustable springs on there (ground control type), and i want to know how low i can go before the AGX's are ineffective. anyone know? if not, thats cool. i can just play with it until i figure it out.

oh yeah and aaron, it choku-dori's like a champ.

chris
TEAM DUCK SNIPER

RBS14
03-09-2003, 02:16 PM
I have a Border Hicas eliminator off of a s13. If you are interested, email me. [email protected]

Thanks Luke

Jsquared
03-09-2003, 04:09 PM
HICAS cars have a tighter steering rack? can you swap a HICAS rack to a non-Hicas S13 for tighter steering?

TXMike
03-11-2003, 08:13 AM
how hard would it be to setup HICAS on a car not originally equiped with it? it would be a nice addition to an upcoming s14 project for daily driving.

KoukiS14
03-11-2003, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by Jsquared
HICAS cars have a tighter steering rack? can you swap a HICAS rack to a non-Hicas S13 for tighter steering?

It's my understanding that you CAN do this. . yupyup. .
I was considering doing it from a HICAS S14, but since ALL HICAS S14s were Silvias, and thus RHD. . I dunno. . I'm not mechanic, but I bet that won't work haha

KoukiS14
03-11-2003, 10:22 AM
Originally posted by TXMike
how hard would it be to setup HICAS on a car not originally equiped with it? it would be a nice addition to an upcoming s14 project for daily driving.

I don't know if anyone's attempted this, but. . . I'd LOVE to at least get 4ws on my S14. . probably pretty hard, finding Silvias in the U.S. to pull parts of MIGHT be a problem (shipping from Japan'd be a bitch). . but. . I've seen whole silvias here. . so maybe not so bad. . Not sure hehe. .

I wonder if S13 parts would work. . if so, I wish I had kept them from my S13 haha

AKADriver
03-11-2003, 10:34 AM
People ship rear subframes all the time, an S14 HICAS rear subframe shouldn't be impossible to get.

But then there's the wiring/controller, and power steering lines to the back, etc... not easy stuff to add.

nrcooled
03-11-2003, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by AKADriver
People ship rear subframes all the time, an S14 HICAS rear subframe shouldn't be impossible to get.

But then there's the wiring/controller, and power steering lines to the back, etc... not easy stuff to add.

You need the steering rack for HICAS. There are two banjo fittings on the steering rack that supply pressure to the rear steering rack.

1. Steering rack
2. High pressure fittings and lines
3. Rear subframe (w/ tie rods)
4. Steering pump (HICAS has an additional line coming out)
5. ECU from HICAS equiped car (which will be for a SR so be ready to swap on the s14)

In my opinion not worth the trouble. I have a HICAS s13 and it's not really a big deal) It does help keep the a$s end behind you on the track though

Edit: Forget about getting coilovers because you will not be able to keep the correct toe and camber that HICAS requires to correct it's self for steering input

KoukiS14
03-11-2003, 03:30 PM
Originally posted by AKADriver
People ship rear subframes all the time, an S14 HICAS rear subframe shouldn't be impossible to get.

But then there's the wiring/controller, and power steering lines to the back, etc... not easy stuff to add.

d'oh. .yeah, u are correct. . :)

SHINCHU
03-12-2003, 07:07 AM
cant keep the correct toe and camber with coilovers? so what is happening now that i have eibach sportlines? the car is lowered, therefore changing at least the camber, and the hicas still works fine. sorry, but that just doesnt make sense.

chris
TEAM DUCK SNIPER

nrcooled
03-12-2003, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Shinchu180sx
cant keep the correct toe and camber with coilovers? so what is happening now that i have eibach sportlines? the car is lowered, therefore changing at least the camber, and the hicas still works fine. sorry, but that just doesnt make sense.

chris
TEAM DUCK SNIPER

I don't know the actuall measurements on what they need to be for HICAS equiped car but that is the primary reason that manufaturers don't make suspension parts specifically for the HICAS 240s. My system lowered 1.75"front and 1.25" rear now is a little "quirky" during highspeed cornering. After going to Nissan to ask some questions (they wouldn't touch my car w/ a ten foot pole) I was informed that HICAS needs exact specs on camber caster toe and the like to be effective and stable at speed.

To me it's not severe enough to take the suspension off but a little unstable at speed around corners. Just a FYI.

Dousan_PG
03-12-2003, 01:36 PM
toe changes w/ camber changes. not dramatically but it still changes.

hey shinchu give me your hicas steering rack! hahaha

SHINCHU
03-12-2003, 07:37 PM
no way dood its MINE! hahaha

my suspension feels fine when cornering at high speed. i feel like i can nail the throttle at any time during the corner and still keep it pointed exactly where i want to with no "quirks" or whatever you call them. i have KYB AGX in front, stock rear, and sportlines all the way around. this set up on hicas is awsome when you set the AGX at 3 for touge, 2 for daily drive and drift. i tried 4 at drift showoff and i dont think enough wieght was transfering but i was still pulling some nice drifts. anyway, my point is i took it on a touge run on saturday night, and i felt like i couldnt go fast enough through corners. it took everything i threw at it. i actually backed off cuz i was scared i would push it too hard because of over-confidence from the suspension feel. but what do i know i've only been doing touge for like 7 years. before i even called it "touge". what are you used to, a porsche? im not flaming i just have a hard time believing a hicas car could suffer that much from such a minor change in ride hieght. maybe your specific car has poblems? have you driven other hicas cars with lowered suspensions? im just really curious whats going on.

chris
TEAM DUCK SNIPER

rps13sh
11-08-2003, 02:43 PM
Originally posted by misnomer
**** dood, I feel like I'm one of the only guys who would trade up to HICAS in a heartbeat. . . :P

And here everybody is trying to kill it.


i would never kill it.

gotime242
11-08-2003, 04:14 PM
Alright, i need to jump in on this.

I havnt bought my s13 yet, but i think there is one for sale close with Hicas, but im afraid that when i start getting into it, with drifting, autocross, and high-speed turns with lowered suspesnion and all, that it would make thigns squirly.


Phase II Motortrend has an eliminator kit for 145.00
http://store.yahoo.com/phase2motorsports/tomhicelkit.html

But, once this is diconnected, how much crap is going to be left over to just weight the car down... How much does the HICAS sstem weigh? I will be doing weight reduction on the s13, so this is kind of important.

I also like to keep things simple, and just dont know if i want a hicas-equipped car...

So what about that weight? And what does the system include that i could remove, or have to leave?

And it sucks that i wouldnt be able to do an after market steering wheel, because that is very important to me as well. Or do they make a hub?

Thanks

gotime242
11-08-2003, 04:29 PM
Also, i dont even want power steering. So could i just rip everything out all together?

HaLo
11-08-2003, 09:16 PM
Originally posted by -zeroCool-
Also, i dont even want power steering. So could i just rip everything out all together?

Why wouldn't you want powersteering?????

:confused:

gotime242
11-09-2003, 05:02 PM
I duno, im just used to not having it, and like the manual feeling, plus i can ditch a few pds with out having it...

HaLo
11-09-2003, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by -zeroCool-
I duno, im just used to not having it, and like the manual feeling, plus i can ditch a few pds with out having it...

whatever floats your boat. I wouldn't ditch the powersteering.

misnomer
11-09-2003, 10:19 PM
comical "I would not kill it" revives an eight month old thread :P

Anyhow, very rarely should you go by an advertisement for information on the need for a part. They are trying to sell you the part. Heck, we used to try to convince people shit would give them fellatio to sell things at CompUSA :P