What's better s14 or s13 sr20det

[bizarroxxx]

OK, I am about to get a motor, and I have heard that the s13 sr20det motor is better for making power and reliability then the s14 sr20det, I need some solid, unbiased answers to this question I have a 95 240sx and I am no stranger to import performance cars, however I am new to this platform, any help would be much appreciated. <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/eh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':eh:'>

[SimpleS14]

They are both reliable motors, its just that some people claim the S13 to the easy of the two to upgrade and get more power. But IMO the S14 motor is much better, I say this because there are two people that each own a S14. One with a '95 w/S13 and the other with a '96 w/S14. The one with S14 had an easy install and more HP to start off with. &nbsp;When it comes to heavy modding, there are no trobules or worries....all he has to do is disconnect the VTC to use all the power he's gaining from upgrades. The S13 required a little more work on the install and always loses to the S14....yet both cars are still good. (not trying to diss anyone)

If you have the $$$ go for the S14 SR...its what the car was meant to come with.

[BEISSEN]

Th s13 motor is better if planning to upgrade the turbo anyway.It is cheaper thus eaving more money for upgrades.One you will spend about 1500.00 for about 20hp more and two i is alot harder to a s14 motor right now.It is only a little easier to install the s14 cus it is a direct motor as well the s13 just alot more stuff to get in.I personally think the s13 is better.The only eason the s14 has more power is cus it is a straight bb and a litle biger turbo the s13 has a T25 and the s14 has a T28.The s13 is said to be better for higher boos applications due to side feed and not bottom feed injectors like the s14 sr.

[Foxcolt]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (BEISSEN @ Oct. 21 2002,12:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Th s13 motor is better if planning to upgrade the turbo anyway.It is cheaper thus eaving more money for upgrades.One you will spend about 1500.00 for about 20hp more and two i is alot harder to a s14 motor right now.It is only a little easier to install the s14 cus it is a direct motor as well the s13 just alot more stuff to get in.I personally think the s13 is better.The only eason the s14 has more power is cus it is a straight bb and a litle biger turbo the s13 has a T25 and the s14 has a T28.The s13 is said to be better for higher boos applications due to side feed and not bottom feed injectors like the s14 sr.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
All SR's have sidefeed injectors.

S14 has a low port intake manifold design
S13 Has a high port intake manifold design

It's been Rumored that the s13's manifold flows better due to tell bends however nothing has been proven.

"and two i is alot harder to a s14 motor right now"

Huh? I don't know what you mean. But regardless your wrong.


Jed

[Foxcolt]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (GT specR @ Oct. 20 2002,11:14)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">They are both reliable motors, its just that some people claim the S13 to the easy of the two to upgrade and get more power. But IMO the S14 motor is much better, I say this because there are two people that each own a S14. One with a '95 w/S13 and the other with a '96 w/S14. The one with S14 had an easy install and more HP to start off with. When it comes to heavy modding, there are no trobules or worries....all he has to do is disconnect the VTC to use all the power he's gaining from upgrades. The S13 required a little more work on the install and always loses to the S14....yet both cars are still good. (not trying to diss anyone)

If you have the $$$ go for the S14 SR...its what the car was meant to come with.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Please please please guys do some research before you make posts.

Disconnet VTC? Why would he ever want to do that? Regardless of what mods he does? Upgraded cams (which is the only mod that effects VTC) for the S14 allow it to keep it's VTC. You'll never have to disconnet it. Remember it's not V-TEC the cams don't have extra lobes.

Your right about the S14 being faster. Remember though this particular S14 is a little special. Don't sterotype all s14 SR's to act just like the one you've seen.

S13 install did not take anymore work than s14. Things go a little slower when you don't have air tools.

Jed <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/devil.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':devil:'>

[Jeff240sx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (BEISSEN @ Oct. 21 2002,02:03)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The only eason the s14 has more power is cus it is a straight bb and a litle biger turbo the s13 has a T25 and the s14 has a T28.
The s13 is said to be better for higher boos applications due to side feed and not bottom feed injectors like the s14 sr.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yea. &nbsp;I'm not an sr guru or anything, but if you want my advice, it's don't listen to this guy.
First... the s14 doesn't have more power because it is a t28. &nbsp;It is a t25. &nbsp;The T28 didn't come on the SR untill the s15 motor, when it recieved larger injectors to match the larger turbo. &nbsp;The s14 makes more power due to the manifold design and the variable timing.
Second, there are 2 types of injectors. &nbsp;Side feed, and top feed. &nbsp;No bottom feed. &nbsp;All SR motors, and KA motors, use side feed injectors. &nbsp;They are all cross-compatible, too.
But heres my advice.
The s14 motor only costs $300-500 more than a redtop, and is gauranteed to come from a '95-whenever. &nbsp;As opposed to a motor that is 5+years older. &nbsp;I personally, would spend the extra cash to get a lower mileage motor. &nbsp;
Oh yea. &nbsp;With a s14 motor, you can keep your air conditioning, too. &nbsp;You'll have to rig things, and use your KA condenser or something... but you can have AC... In Florida, that is everyone's dream.
-Jeff

[Foxcolt]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jeff240sx @ Oct. 21 2002,10:07)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteBegin--BEISSEN+Oct. 21 2002,02<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (BEISSEN @ Oct. 21 2002,02<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'>3)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The only eason the s14 has more power is cus it is a straight bb and a litle biger turbo the s13 has a T25 and the s14 has a T28.
The s13 is said to be better for higher boos applications due to side feed and not bottom feed injectors like the s14 sr.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yea. I'm not an sr guru or anything, but if you want my advice, it's don't listen to this guy.
First... the s14 doesn't have more power because it is a t28. It is a t25. The T28 didn't come on the SR untill the s15 motor, when it recieved larger injectors to match the larger turbo. The s14 makes more power due to the manifold design and the variable timing.
Second, there are 2 types of injectors. Side feed, and top feed. No bottom feed. All SR motors, and KA motors, use side feed injectors. They are all cross-compatible, too.
But heres my advice.
The s14 motor only costs $300-500 more than a redtop, and is gauranteed to come from a '95-whenever. As opposed to a motor that is 5+years older. I personally, would spend the extra cash to get a lower mileage motor.
Oh yea. With a s14 motor, you can keep your air conditioning, too. You'll have to rig things, and use your KA condenser or something... but you can have AC... In Florida, that is everyone's dream.
-Jeff</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
All s14 SR's come with t28's

My 98 Blacktop S13 SR came with 44 thousand miles. Better than most s14's I see.

VTC add's somewhere in the range of 8hp Dyno proven.

In order to keep AC in any S14 regardless of Year SR takes the same amount of work. It's just as hard/easy to make AC work in a s13 SR than S14 SR since you basicly have two choices. New AC lines for SR condenser. Keep KA condenser and rewire system outside of ECU.

As far as price that's all relative. A guy tried to charge me 7 grand for a redtop once. He had a Skyline so tried real hard not to laugh in his face <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/laugh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':laugh:'>

This is what I say to everyone that's planning to get an SR.
1, if you plan on upgrading turbo anytime soon (soon being the key word) get a blacktop s13
2, If you don't get an s14

Simple, but that's my opinion.
Jed <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/devil.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':devil:'>

[AKADriver]

The S14 SR20DET has a T28 BB, not a T25. &nbsp;The S15's turbo is the same size as the S14's, but it has an Inconel turbine wheel.

The VCT enhances bottom end torque and throttle response, not top end power.

You can keep AC with an S13 engine as well.

An S13 blacktop is also guaranteed to be just as new.

[uiuc240]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jeff240sx @ Oct. 21 2002,10:07)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Second, there are 2 types of injectors. Side feed, and top feed. No bottom feed. All SR motors, and KA motors, use side feed injectors. They are all cross-compatible, too.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Wrong. &nbsp;Only the injectors from KA24DEs are compatible. &nbsp;KA24Es use top feed injectors (I know because I had to replace mine). &nbsp;Just adding to the infopile.

Eric

[Jeff240sx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (uiuc240 @ Oct. 21 2002,1:32)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteBegin--Jeff240sx+Oct. 21 2002,10<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jeff240sx @ Oct. 21 2002,10<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'>7)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Second, there are 2 types of injectors. Side feed, and top feed. No bottom feed. All SR motors, and KA motors, use side feed injectors. They are all cross-compatible, too.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Wrong. Only the injectors from KA24DEs are compatible. KA24Es use top feed injectors (I know because I had to replace mine). Just adding to the infopile.

Eric</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yea. &nbsp;I know. &nbsp;I didn't bother mentioning that because there are too many differences in the KA24e's. &nbsp;Clutch, flywheel, injectors, ect. &nbsp;So when I use KA, I always mean KA24DE. &nbsp;I really don't like typing out the entire engine code.
I also don't know shit about the KA-E, and don't really wanna know, so I stay away from them.
Sorry if I confused anyone on that.

And also, I really didn't know the s13 blacktop ran to '98, or the s14 had t28 turbos. &nbsp;Now they are pretty respectable in my book &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/thumbs-up.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':thumbsup:'>
-Jeff

[uiuc240]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Jeff240sx @ Oct. 21 2002,11:49)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">So when I use KA, I always mean KA24DE. I really don't like typing out the entire engine code.
I also don't know shit about the KA-E, and don't really wanna know, so I stay away from them.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
gotcha. &nbsp;Actually, I think it's just because you know they suck. &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'> &nbsp;I hated my SOHC. &nbsp;What a POS motor. &nbsp;Not smooth. &nbsp;Doesn't breathe. &nbsp;Horrible secondary systems. &nbsp;I could go on.

But because it sucked so bad, now I have an SR20DET...so yay.

Eric

[RedSuns]

Wait until i post my dyno runs with my S14 SR...i did two runs...one with VTC and one without VTC......i did both runs at 10psi....with the VTC disengaged i lost almost 30 hp and 40 ft-lbs.......i will scan the runs and post them.....

[bizarroxxx]

Well thanks guys I appreciate the help. Maybe one of you will know of a website that I can get a pre-assembled wiring harness? If so let me know. THANKS AGAIN!!!

[Jeff240sx]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (bizarroxxx @ Oct. 23 2002,11:11)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Well thanks guys I appreciate the help. Maybe one of you will know of a website that I can get a pre-assembled wiring harness? If so let me know. THANKS AGAIN!!!</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
I've heard heavy-throttle sells them. &nbsp;Heavy-throttle.com. &nbsp;
-Jeff

[SilviaDriver]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Foxcolt @ Oct. 21 2002,08:30)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">This is what I say to everyone that's planning to get an SR.
1, if you plan on upgrading turbo anytime soon (soon being the key word) get a blacktop s13
2, If you don't get an s14</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
i dont get that, i read it many times but still dont understand

does upgrading a turbo in the S14 SR harder or something than the S13?

[HippoSleek]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (cIvIcKILLA240style @ Oct. 21 2002,6:48)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Wait until i post my dyno runs with my S14 SR...i did two runs...one with VTC and one without VTC......i did both runs at 10psi....with the VTC disengaged i lost almost 30 hp and 40 ft-lbs.......i will scan the runs and post them.....</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Hmm - to me, this goes to the point that if the s13 had the s14's turbo, it would be more powerful - even w/o VTC. &nbsp;(I always get confused whether this is the proper term) &nbsp;

I've always heard the s13 head is superior to the s14 head b/c of emissions issues. &nbsp;That said, the fact that VTC was only able to create 15 more hp and NO more tq - AFTER adding a larger turbo, leads me to believe that the s13 will be stronger that the s14 if you use the T28. &nbsp;(I thought the s14 T28 was not bb?)

A/C - as of this summer, no one was running a/c w/ an s14 SR. &nbsp;Yuri in NY and Vik in FL was working on it and may have gotten it hardwired or something by now. &nbsp;s13's have been able to run a/c for as long as I can remember w/ a custom fab'ed bracket.

Install should be the same, but I've heard a few people claim the s14 was a little easier for some reason.

s14 SR were sold in late 93 for the 94 model year in Japan - so you could get a fully 8 year old s14 SR, as w/ an s13 blacktop.

[Foxcolt]

Very interesting point Hipposleek.

When Johnathan did his runs, his numbers were much higher than they would be on an s13 (from the normal s13 dyno numbers). The VTC seemed to just up the numbers a bit. However I don't like stereo typing his motor as the normal s14 sr since I'm about 99.9% positive he has something special in there.

About my previous statement.

lets say you buy a motor and plan on upgrading the turbo as soon as you get the motor in the car. Would you buy the more expensive motor with the bigger stock turbo. Or the less expensive (pretty much the same) motor with a smaller turbo.

I hope that makes more sense <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>

Now about this high port low port thing.

How would we get a diffenative anwser? Could we flowbench both heads? At somepoint in the next year or so I'm going to be upgrading the springs valves yada in my s13 Sr head. I wouldn't mind sending it off to a flowbench to get it tested. That way we'll at least have some concrete numbers to play with.

Jed <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/devil.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':devil:'>

[RedSuns]

still one thing that i want bring up in the S13 vs S14 SR is in the VTC.......if i unplug the solenoid then theorettically it is the same as the S13 valve train........right....for some reason i see it as being different......i am sure nissan had to change the intial timing of the intake cam on the S14 to then compensate for the VTC.....does this make sense to anyone.....anyone care to argue....i just can't see to find any hard facts.....

[S14lover]

Ok Ok VTEC is Honda and that has something to do with the lobes on there cams right....Ok VTC what/where does this fucntion do/happen and is it like VTEC ? &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/huh.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':huh:'>

[RedSuns]

VTC works with the timing of the intake cam....depending on the readings of TPS/MAFS and speed sensor is how much the intake cam is retarded...it can be retarded up to a maximum of 22 degrees.....somehow I don't see how the reatardation(not funny) can affect a powerband of the engine....but it does...I am yet to learn the true effectivenss(I will) of how it does produce power gains, but i will learn it shortly.....i will scan my dyno runs shortly so i can show the differences...

[S14lover]

I have an S14 chassis zenki body and would love to have an S14 SR20 for my car &nbsp;BUT after looking around ive noticed there alot more S13 SR20 parts out there and more readily available then S14 parts . like i said at the beginnning i would love the S14 engine cuz i have an S14 BUt .....thats all im saying is BUT <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'> &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'> &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':angry:'> &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/whatsthat.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':whatthe:'>