Failed Smog and Idle is said to be Wrong

[Drift N Dragg]

I just went to get Smogged today and I fail Bad.. I have a High Flow Cat with a 3 in Catback Exhaust.. Stock manifold.. Would this be a problem with CA Smog? The Guy didnt care I had them and smogged me anyways. Also he said my Timing should be 15 Degrees and he said my Car was 20 degrees.. I was advanced..he didnt retard it. he just let left it 20 degrees.. Could that effect my smog test? Also could that be a reason was around 2000 - 3500 RPMS i feel like I have no power? that all the power is after that rpms?

Thanks

[nissanguy13]

Mine just failed smog too. But mine was due to a bad cat, bad gas cap, that I know of so far. My timing was 22 degrees and idled fine. 3" exhaust and high flow cat shouldn't fail you. Most shops only sell cats that will pass smog. What brand of cat and exhaust do you have.

[Drift N Dragg]

I passed everything but Emissions .. I was like way off and its all new.. he also failed me for the timing too.. said it was (tampered)

[nissanguy13]

emissions could be a lot of things. Do you have an s13 or s14? It could be from plugs, wires, O2 sensor, there's a lot that can make you fail emissions.

[Drift N Dragg]

I have a s13 (91 240sx Coupe SE) ... Plugs are brand new Irdium, Wires are brand new.. Complete tune-up... the car isn't throwing any codes ...that i know of

[drift freaq]

lol tampered timing. If your car is a 89-90 timing should be set at 10 -15degrees BTDC . If its a 91 up you set at 20 BTDC or you can even set it a 15 , I honestly don't know why he told you 20 was wrong. Retarded will not effect if you pass or fail where as advanced will. The machine will fail you if your timing is advanced. Its quite simple to retard your timing. Get yourself a FSM or Haynes book on our cars. They will show you how to do it if you don't know already. It also would not hurt to do a tune up and clean out your throttle body and AIV/EGR system. That is easily done by taking off your piping just in front of the throttle body and spraying carb cleaner in your throttle body as you rev your engine. You must be revving the engine when you do this though otherwise it will choke and die. You will see a plume of smoke out your tailpipe thats ok thats just all the shit burning out. If you follow these steps it should pass. Also make sure that your hoses going to your egr valve and bpt valve are not cracked or leaking. This is another common problem on our cars that cause 's failed smogs.

[nissanguy13]

You replaced the cap and rotor too? Did you check and make sure all cylinders are getting spark to them (sorry not trying to insult you, just trying to cover everything.) what's wrong at 2500-3000rpms? What brand of exhaust and cat? Do you know the numbers, if so post them and that might help people figure it out.

Drift Freaq: since you are talking about cleaning out the throttle body etc. Would you suggest the carb cleaner over seam foam? I was going to try that this weekend, I'm bringing it up since he might have some similiar problems.

[Drift N Dragg]

No Problem.. not insulted at all... Yeah Cap rotor were replaced.. All cylinders are firing.. 2000 - 3500 RPMS i will press on the gas and it feels like i have no power.. kinda like a underpowered truck towing a 20' boat up the Grapevine.. press the pedal and it doesnt go anywhere.. the Emissions numbers were "HC (PPM)" the Max was 118 - My Car 180 ... "CO (%)" Max was 0.75 - My Car 1.01 .... "NO (PPM)" Max was 799 - My Car 1938 ....... does that help?

[drift freaq]

You replaced the cap and rotor too? Did you check and make sure all cylinders are getting spark to them (sorry not trying to insult you, just trying to cover everything.) what's wrong at 2500-3000rpms? What brand of exhaust and cat? Do you know the numbers, if so post them and that might help people figure it out.

Drift Freaq: since you are talking about cleaning out the throttle body etc. Would you suggest the carb cleaner over seam foam? I was going to try that this weekend, I'm bringing it up since he might have some similiar problems.

well I have personally never done the seafoam deal. Some people swear by it.
To the OP , how many miles are on your engine? How are your injectors? Was your car tested at a test only?

[nissanguy13]

Damn your car was worse than mine. Sounds like your mafs is dirty or bad if you have no power/stumbling over 2000rpms

Edit: Mine was 157, .87, and 1772

[Drift N Dragg]

The injectors are good, had them tested.. No I went to a full Smog Place.. there are 200,000 miles on the engine.. i haven't heard of the sea foam thing either

[ma71supraturbo]

the Emissions numbers were "HC (PPM)" the Max was 118 - My Car 180 ... "CO (%)" Max was 0.75 - My Car 1.01 .... "NO (PPM)" Max was 799 - My Car 1938 ....... does that help?

Was this at idle or 2500rpm? what were your o2 numbers?

[Drift N Dragg]

/that was at 15mph ... o2% at 15mph was 1.2.... @ 25mph ... HC max was 93.. my car 133 .....CO max was 0.63.. my car 0.82 ................ NO max 738 ... my car 1449 .............. --1772 RPMS %CO2 13.5 - %O2 1.2 ...... 2827 RPMS %CO2 13.8 - %O2 1.0 .... Do you know what these mean? Besides the fact I failed ... HAHA!!

[deesz]

i just failed also, mine was because of the new ca smog law where they pump your gas tank full of nitrogen and see how fast it bleeds off, mine bled off right away....
good luck.........
i have also hear high flow cats arnt all that great for smog.

[4thHorse]

there are alot of videos on youtube about seafoam. I wouldn't use that stuff in my front yard, to much smoke. I myself never used it, but heard it works great.

[ma71supraturbo]

High NOx means your combustion temperatures are high. Back off timing and double/triple check EGR system.

High CO means your car is not burning fuel efficiently/completely. High HC is an indication of the same, but can also be running rich and/or your car is burning oil.

I would replace O2 sensor, clean all ground wires, and get a new (non high-flow) cat. Also spray carb cleaner around the vacuum hoses and listen for any change in rpm -- if you find one, replace that hose.

[Drift N Dragg]

I think I am burning Oil... I had to add 2qt the other day.. Thanks though I atleast know what i am looking at now..

[bbejj123]

/that was at 15mph ... o2% at 15mph was 1.2.... @ 25mph ... HC max was 93.. my car 133 .....CO max was 0.63.. my car 0.82 ................ NO max 738 ... my car 1449 .............. --1772 RPMS %CO2 13.5 - %O2 1.2 ...... 2827 RPMS %CO2 13.8 - %O2 1.0 .... Do you know what these mean? Besides the fact I failed ... HAHA!!

i know that if your no is to high it might be because of a vacuum leak or maybe an exhaust leak...ive also had problems passing smog fortunately all i need to do it lower my NO...but i also know that with newer spark plugs it highers the NO but stick with new ones...sorry thats all i know haha kinda new at the whole smog thing...ive been driving my 75 bmw 2002 smog exempt =)

[ma71supraturbo]

I think I am burning Oil... I had to add 2qt the other day.. Thanks though I atleast know what i am looking at now..

wow, thats a lot of oil. In that case, I'd do a compression check first (both wet & dry).

[Drift N Dragg]

Ok.. I will check that tomorrow

[drift freaq]

if your actually burning a lot of oil your not going to pass period. I have made gross polluters pass following the steps I outlined. If you do those steps and still fail well then your engine may be toast. 200k miles is a lot. It is the getting into the upper range of the longevity and if it was not properly maintained then ya it will fail.

[Drift N Dragg]

What kinda Steps? I bought the car this way.. Thats why I am tring to smog it.. for Transfer of title

[bbejj123]

lol tampered timing. If your car is a 89-90 timing should be set at 10 -15degrees BTDC . If its a 91 up you set at 20 BTDC or you can even set it a 15 , I honestly don't know why he told you 20 was wrong. Retarded will not effect if you pass or fail where as advanced will. The machine will fail you if your timing is advanced. Its quite simple to retard your timing. Get yourself a FSM or Haynes book on our cars. They will show you how to do it if you don't know already. It also would not hurt to do a tune up and clean out your throttle body and AIV/EGR system. That is easily done by taking off your piping just in front of the throttle body and spraying carb cleaner in your throttle body as you rev your engine. You must be revving the engine when you do this though otherwise it will choke and die. You will see a plume of smoke out your tailpipe thats ok thats just all the shit burning out. If you follow these steps it should pass. Also make sure that your hoses going to your egr valve and bpt valve are not cracked or leaking. This is another common problem on our cars that cause 's failed smogs.

he wants you to follow these directions and you should pass if your engine isnt completely toast :rawk:

[Drift N Dragg]

Ah..For sure, I got alot of work ahead of me tomorrow

[bbejj123]

Ah..For sure, I got alot of work ahead of me tomorrow
haha im right there with ya mines just going downhill...haha i spent 400 bucks today =/ and now my brake master cylinder went out :duh: and still need to fix my vacuum and exhaust leak to pass smog...because i also need to get my smog done cause i just bought my car too

[Drift N Dragg]

damn i feel ya on that... Also Thank you everyone who wrote to help out with this.. Thats one reason why I like this Forum.. People willing to share there knowledge.. again thanks

[drift freaq]

Plus it would not hurt to make sure all your electrical plug connections are okay. Another common problem with our cars is the coolant temp sensor plug shorting, causing the car to run like crap. Of course usually when that happens your check engine light comes on. I would aslo check your maf due to your whole lack of power deal at 200-3000 rpm. A bad maf will throw you engine ecu into close looped mode causing the engine to stumble above 2500 rpm.

[916S14]

Yeah i dont know about the timing seems like the smog guy was on one. My s14 was 20 degrees timing or around that range and passed just fine. But if everything else fails get some methanol mix it about 20%methanol to 80% gas mixture and your emissions will be dramatically better. But wouldnt recomend it...

[Drift N Dragg]

Ok, I guess i was throwing codes.. but My light never kicked on.. the light kicks on when it starts then shuts off.. Here's what it threw ..23, 45.. now it gave another but Its hard to say what it is.. it blinks long .. then a long pause then blinks into the 23 then 45... I don't know what a 1 long blink with nothing after it means.. I mean the long and shorts are easy to tell apart. I keep throwing that leaky Injector code.. I have changed out injecters with my Other S13.... so I am at a loss.. any advice.. Oh Also.. Drift Freaq - I did the steps and I cant get the ilde Below 850 RPMS.. it hovers from 850 to 900... I also sprayed Carb cleaner on all the vacuum lines and the car didnt stumble.. it stayed at idle.. Ideas?

[ma71supraturbo]

compression numbers?

[idlafie]

See if you can download a Factory Service Manual here from Zilvia.net....use the SEARCH function. You'll need it to fix your smog problems.

Your High HC readings are probably because your idle is not set properly. You'll have to disconnect your throttle body subharness to properly set your idle to 700-750 rpm. After you've set your idle to 700-750 rpm, then test your O2 sensor. Your FSM will tell you how to put it into Diagnostic Mode. If your O2 sensor fails the test, then replace it. Bad signals from your Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor AND your O2 sensor will cause high HC readings.

Your high NO readings are because your EGR system is not working as it should. You'll need to test the two solenoid valves behind your valve cover between the engine & the firewall to see if they are working properly. They control vacuum & airflow going to your BPT & EGR valves. No signal from those solenoid valves and/or melted/cut/disconnected vacuum lines will lead to high NO readings.

The attached link is from the California Bureau of Automotive Repair. It's a glossary listing all the information on your smog check form and the possible causes / reasons why you failed smog: (cut & paste if the link doesn't work when you click on it).

http://159.145.15.175/stdPAge.asp?Menu=/includes/Menu_GenInfo.htm&Body=/Geninfo/OtherInfo/Vehicle_Inspection_Report_Glossary-May_1996.htm#hc

I've tuned a lot of S13's and S14's to help pass smog, (ask DriftFreq - he's watched me do it several times). If you want to use SeaFoam to clean out your combustion chamber just view the following link on YouTube on how to do it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZf4WXwVL_E

The vehicle shown is a Toyota, but the same principle applies....Remove the vacuum line from the brake booster as the engine is running. Make sure you remove the vacuum line BEFORE the round check valve from the engine (left) side and not the brake booster (right) side. DO NOT remove the brake booster line directly from the brake booster. The round check valve will interfere with the suctioning action as the check valve only allows vacuum from one direction. The vacuum line is accessible from the passenger side of the car and comes up from the idle adjust valve and follows the firewall to the brakebooster. Once you disconnect the vacuum line from the round check valve, you will hear a hissing sound and the idle will go to crap just like in the video. Pour some Seafoam solution into a small plastic cup and allow the engine vacuum to suck the Seafoam solution from the cup. Just make sure someone is pressing on the gas as you are sucking the Seafoam from the cup. Once you are done, reconnect the vacuum line back to the brake booster. CHECK AND MAKE SURE YOUR BRAKE BOOSTER IS GETTING VACUUM AND WORKING PROPERLY before you take your car for a test drive.
SeaFoam does an excellent job of removing carbon buildup on the valves in your combustion chamber. Pouring some in the gas tank also helps clean out your clogged injectors. One thing Drift Freq forgot to mention was check to make sure your Fuel Pressure Regulator is working fine & getting vacuum. A Bad fuel pressure regulator can cause excessive fuel to dump into you combustion chamber & fail smog.

Anyhow, apologize for the long post. Hope this helps...
ID

PS:
How can a guy with 53 posts have a higher REP Power than me...???....hahahaha....

[Drift N Dragg]

Thanks for the Info.. will for sure get on the and I do have a copy of the FSM.. I had been really sick since the last time i posted on this thread so i will also get the Comp PSI and post it..

To your P.S: I am Loved! Or as it says "I am just a all around Nice!"... Ha Ha..

[Drift N Dragg]

Hey and another quick question to this.. I took out my ECU and left it out and that green light flashes like the damn car is gonna blow up at 45 mph all the way too 60 mph... (sorry dont know the RPM.. Tach doesn't work.. go figure, huh) but other then that the light goes off.. or it will come on and stay on for a minute or two then turn off.. But at those speeds (In 5th Gear) that lights goes Crazy... any ideas? does that another thing that has to do with my Smog? Or is my car Possessed?