Dyno results......not what I expected.

[s14unimog]

For all the Atlanta folks, there was a dyno day at Main Stream Performance yesterday. There were tons of other SR's putting down expected numbers and then mine did this.

Black top s13 sr20det
Mods. (Everything that could possibly matter)

Divided SS dump pipe
3" down pipe
3" test
Blitz Nur Spec R catback
Spearco FMIC
2.5" intercooler piping
AEM Pop charger
Blitz SBC-iD boost controller
Aluminum driveshaft
Upgraded clutch
Greddy type RS BOV.
Stock T25 turbo
Stock SR MAFS
Stock 370's

numbers @14psi
225rwhp
268rwtq.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v721/s14unimog/240ATLDynoDay022.jpg

The boost kept falling off to 11 or so after hitting 14.1; I guess that’s the reasoning for the high torque numbers. My thoughts are that my gain settings are set to high and the boost is just coming on to quick and then just falling off or maybe I'm just blowing outside the turbo's efficiency range. Also the fuel map is showing that I'm running quite rich so I need to figure that out as well. Regardless these are weird numbers to add to the list of typical SR20 numbers with these mods.

[RedStage]

good way to keep your boost from falling off is to get the HKS Boost actuator.
nice simple upgrade that makes a difference.

Also, post up what type of dyno it was run on.

[The Riot Hero]

good way to keep your boost from falling off is to get the HKS Boost actuator.
nice simple upgrade that makes a difference.

Also, post up what type of dyno it was run on.

besides the dyno slip saying dynojet in big black letters? hahaha

look like average numbers to me, the torque is weird. but as far as whp kind of low from what ive seen at those boost levels.

theres something wrong with it, probably a boost leak or a bad temp sensor or something.

[arkive43]

Stock T25 turbo
Stock SR MAFS
Stock 370's

??????????? still nice numbers i say....i mean how much were u planing on making?....

[bardabe]

that's pretty good considering the amount of boost you are running. 11lbs is the stock boost levels of the SR so that's where you should leave it at for now untill you have money to upgrade your Fuel Management.

[MADE]

I would say not bad either considering I have an S14
with 740 & PFC and run almost the same thing. So now you know what you got for a baseline time to add more.

[azndoc]

What numbers were YOU expecting?

Seems about right to me.

Then again I don't know shit.

[armand]

that's pretty good considering the amount of boost you are running. 11lbs is the stock boost levels of the SR so that's where you should leave it at for now untill you have money to upgrade your Fuel Management.
stock boost on a sr is 7psi, and those numbers seem about right for a t25 370cc injectors and stock maf. stock s13 sr mafs start to max out at 12-14psi anyway tq numbers seem kind of high

[RedStage]

besides the dyno slip saying dynojet in big black letters? hahaha

doh.....:coolugh:

[unicoladron]

stock boost on a sr is 7psi, and those numbers seem about right for a t25 370cc injectors and stock maf. stock s13 sr mafs start to max out at 12-14psi anyway tq numbers seem kind of high

i didn't see a title that stated "let's argue about stock boost on SRs"...wierd...

anyways. one good thing you have contributed is a nice baseline for all of us who do not have fuel modifications or ecu tunes.

this is the first dyno slip i have seen with "bolt ons" only.

so +1 to you kind sir.

also, don't EBC's have a way of actuating the wastegate to open gradually to have lower boost at lower RPMs and higher boost at the top of the RPM range? or did i make that up? just another thought on how to stop your boost from falling off.

[cotbu]

for dynojet numbers I'd say no not good! set boost @ 11psi get a good baseline.
stock boost on a sr is 7psi, and those numbers seem about right for a t25 370cc injectors and stock maf. stock s13 sr mafs start to max out at 12-14psi anyway tq numbers seem kind of high
Stock boost is not 7psi! The waste gate actuator is set to 7psi!
Airflow maxes a mass air flow sensor out, not boost!
235 to 245 on a dynojet @ 14psi, are good. Maybe hp and tq numbers are backwards. Some of us, still give it to raw and unsmoothed. Smoothing is 5, if this was a just a power pull id get to work on making my power goals happen.

[1cleanS13]

That torque is nuts. My redtop with the same mods made 225whp and 215wtq at 13 psi with ambient temp at 95 degrees. My boost level would also level off towards redline down to around 10 psi. I had my gain about 3/4 to max, I'm still not exactly sure where I should set it to have it not fall off like that.

[HasteBryant]

i think thats about right, with that much boost. not sure as why tourqe is so high though. this is my setup, and i drove four hours from grand junction, CO to Parker, CO near denver and straight to dyno after i arrived. i didnt have a boost gauge at the time but later i found that i was leaking boost from a blown gasket from turbo to manifold. and my fuel rail was bent underneath from jdm kids lifting the engine by fuel rail. i think it was dynoed with a dynojet, will double check though. dynoed by macautosports.com in the mile high city



red top s13 sr20det
Mods.

stock turbo elbow
3" down pipe
3" test
skunk 2; 3" catback
godspeed FMIC
trust air filter
apex safc,
no boost control
stock driveshaft
nismo clutch
blitz DD BOV.
Stock T25 turbo
z32 MAFS
Stock 370's
walbro 255lph fuel pump
koyo oem style copper radiator

numbers @ stock 7psi and leaking.
227rwhp
207rwtq.
i think it was measured on a dynojet. will double check though, dynoed by macautosports.com in parker, CO

[Koopa Troopa]

for dynojet numbers I'd say no not good! set boost @ 11psi get a good baseline.

Stock boost is not 7psi! The waste gate actuator is set to 7psi!
Airflow maxes a mass air flow sensor out, not boost!
235 to 245 on a dynojet @ 14psi, are good. Maybe hp and tq numbers are backwards. Some of us, still give it to raw and unsmoothed. Smoothing is 5, if this was a just a power pull id get to work on making my power goals happen.

If a car without some sort of boost controller has the actuator set to 7 psi then wouldn't that make max boost possible 7 psi since there is nothing to control when the wastegate will open? Rhetoric question BTW...


also, don't EBC's have a way of actuating the wastegate to open gradually to have lower boost at lower RPMs and higher boost at the top of the RPM range? or did i make that up? just another thought on how to stop your boost from falling off.

That's called a boost leak.

[S14DB]

I think you need a tune as your AFR goes down at 4.5k and in the shitter at 5k. You can also see how the HP levels off at 4.5 and then fall on their face.

Think some fuel trim will improve 4K on and that dip at 3-3.5k. Ignition timing will improve that Tq over HP problem too.

[cotbu]

If a car without some sort of boost controller has the actuator set to 7 psi then wouldn't that make max boost possible 7 psi since there is nothing to control when the wastegate will open?
you are correct but this quote is incorrect
stock boost on a sr is 7psi
Rhetorical answer

[usdm180sx]

Those numbers aren't low, they're pretty solid based on your mods. I dyno'd mine on a dynodynamics (reads 16% lower than a dynojet) and it put down 195. On a dynojet that should translate to 225whp, right beside you:

Props to JER! On 11lbs. of boost (set w/HKS actuator) I did 195.7whp at ~4800rpm and 250ft/lbs at 4200 on the Dyno Dynamics dynamometer. This dyno records more accurate numbers than a dynojet. Dynojet numbers are 16% higher on average.

Here are the mods:
SR20DE-T 180sx Blacktop
Greddy turbo elbow
Blitz Stainless downpipe
Blitz LM FMIC
HKS S13 SR20DET SSQV BOV Hot Pipe Kit
HKS T25 turbo wastegate actuator (NOT tuned, running on stock injectors and ECU)
Unknown Brand Test Pipe
Tomei Fuel Pump
Z32 Fuel Filter

Here are the graphs:
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l232/usdmsilvia/S13_dyno_whp_tq.jpg
http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l232/usdmsilvia/s13_af_ratio.jpg

Check out the a/f ratio. At that rate I'll be richer than Bill Gates!

[sr20boostn20]

225whp and 268wtq

aside from the hp being lower than the tq

and you really only have intake exhaust n a front mount. with a boost controler

do you have a upgraded fuel pump?

those numbers seem pretty good the car is still fun to drive right? what were you expecting 300whp 290tq?

[S14DB]

I hate graphs that don't scale HP and TQ the same.

Notice how your TQ graph is flat and the AFR is progressive. His is not.

[cotbu]

At 11psi those number are fine! For 14psi they are not! Boost falling down to 11psi from 14psi should not equal 11psi! That's why I said set your boost to 11psi get a good baseline. You could aslo change 14psi to any other number greater than 14 and this should still make sense.

[s14unimog]

yeah the car is a blast but I'm guessing the gainor something is set too high. I went out last night and messed with the EBC and finally got it to hold 14 and fall to 12 consistantly, but not holding 14. I was expecting 235ish hp and 230/225 tq


ALSO the car has a 300zx TT fuel pump and filter


Also, what do you guys think about that fuel falling so far off? The only time I've seen that is when I did KA-T with a stock KA MAFS and maxed the MAFS out @ 10psi. I remember seeing this untunable flat line, like that one, that kept me @ 7psi. I'm also wondering if that has something to do with the boost falling off.


There is one thing, the car likes to idle at 1200 or 1100 and pull only a 13 vacuum. That makes me think there might be a leak too.

[smoothlinez]

Im a nobody but i think the stock wastegate is obviously open up to early. Yet lets you yield power at low rpm and dies out on top. I would say turn the response on the wastegate down you would have a better hp and tq curve balancing out at 6.5k rpm just my opinion.

[drftmark]

dude... stock boost is 7 psi...

Specifications for Black Top SR20DET

180SX 94-98



Displacement: 1998cc (2.0 liter)

Cam type: DOHC 16 valve, chain driven cam sprockets

Bore and stroke: 86mm x 86mm

Compression: 8.5 : 1

Horsepower: 205hp at 6000rpm

Torque: 203 ft/lbs at 4000rpm

Stock boost: 7 psi

Throttle body bore: 60mm

Injector size: 370cc/min

Turbo specs:

Compressor: T-25, 60 trim 56mm BCI-1 compressor.

Turbine: T-25, 62 trim 53.8mm 0.64 A/R turbine housing.

Center Section: Journal bearings

[s14unimog]

Im a nobody but i think the stock wastegate is obviously open up to early. Yet lets you yield power at low rpm and dies out on top. I would say turn the response on the wastegate down you would have a better hp and tq curve balancing out at 6.5k rpm just my opinion.



EXACTLY!!! that what I've been trying to do for the past two days. Does anyone have boost settings for 14psi on a Blitz SBC-iD

"gain" and "set" settings.


STOCK WASTEGATE IS 7PSI You can get 11psi stock if you use the factory silenoid

[statik]

STOCK BOOST IS 7PSI

Its a common misconception. Yes, the stock wastegate spring is 7psi, but there is also a stock boost solenoid that held boost to ~11psi. 7psi is "safety boost" when you throw a cel the boost solenoid basically shut off, just like the 300zx does. Thats why you see a lot of jdm "tuned" ecu's that increase boost.

[s14unimog]

Its a common misconception. Yes, the stock wastegate spring is 7psi, but there is also a stock boost solenoid that held boost to ~11psi. 7psi is "safety boost" when you throw a cel the boost solenoid basically shut off, just like the 300zx does. Thats why you see a lot of jdm "tuned" ecu's that increase boost.


Nick, I'm going to light you on fire!

I corrected myself, BTW

[statik]

Nick, I'm going to light you on fire!

I corrected myself, BTW

you can't even spell solenoid, no wonder you can't hold boost! *ZING* ...and now back to Brandons thread

[s14unimog]

you can't even spell solenoid, no wonder you can't hold boost! *ZING* ...and now back to Brandons thread


Grammer was never you forte' either "Brandons"....didn't you mean "Brandon's?"

:Owned: with love!

[jspaeth]

Grammer was never you forte' either "Brandons"....didn't you mean "Brandon's?"

:Owned: with love!


haha and I guess spelling isn't your forte hahah

G-R-A-M-M-A-R

j/p

[s14unimog]

haha and I guess spelling isn't your forte hahah

G-R-A-M-M-A-R

j/p



haha, damn it you got me :mephfawk:

Grammar wars never end nice

[steve shadows]

check your base timing might be slightly retarded.

other than that excellent numbers for shitty t25

[Doluck]

OMG I have to find Travis Deems dyno sheet.... 317 on a built motor and a T25

[johngriff]

yeah, now go run it on a dynodynamics ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcSBurP8yLs

[Doluck]

Thats what we have..

[Doluck]

I'm gusing it was all about the built 9:1 motor.. dunno really. He said in Japan the have no prob getting 300+ out of them of 400+ form a T28.. The same thing weldrft from Japan said...


But I know the rules... unless I find that sheet... it never happend.. :rolleyes:

[statik]

I'm gusing it was all about the built 9:1 motor.. dunno really. He said in Japan the have no prob getting 300+ out of them of 400+ form a T28.. The same thing weldrft from Japan said...


But I know the rules... unless I find that sheet... it never happend.. :rolleyes:

300+ on a t25 and 400+ on a t28? Unless you are using magic, I'm calling BS, sorry

[GSXRJJordan]

^^^ Magic = n2o.

Do the math on the airflow numbers, the T25 and T28 physically can't push enough air to make that much power on gasoline, without nitrous.

I'm all for a 300whp t28 car (cams, injectors, HG, tune, that's it) with a 100shot. That's actually my planned build :)

[usdm180sx]

I'm all for a 300whp t28 car (cams, injectors, HG, tune, that's it) with a 100shot. That's actually my planned build :)

You don't need nawssss to get 300whp with an s15 spec r t28, just intake, cams, injectors, front mount, full exhaust and tuning.

*edited

[smoothlinez]

try lowering the (gain) I usually set the psi/kpa/bar at 14.6/100/1.0 then -gain- 10% and up. It really depends, you must have some more dyno time to play with it to get that initial sweet spot. Most of the time tuning cars once your done playing with the af mixture and ignition setting. You also have to play with the boost controller. But anyhow just my opinion best of luck getting more dyno time. But no doubt your on a good note indicating your afr at W.O.T fall off to super rich after 4k rpm 10 afr and lower. Definitely something that need fiddling with the boost settings. Or if any case might have a possible clutch slippage failure Just my opinion.

[johngriff]

Thats what we have..

I'm gusing it was all about the built 9:1 motor.. dunno really. He said in Japan the have no prob getting 300+ out of them of 400+ form a T28.. The same thing weldrft from Japan said...


But I know the rules... unless I find that sheet... it never happend.. :rolleyes:

No one cares, where did you just pop into this thread at.

try lowering the (gain) I usually set the psi/kpa/bar at 14.6/100/1.0 then -gain- 10% and up. It really depends, you must have some more dyno time to play with it to get that initial sweet spot. Most of the time tuning cars once your done playing with the af mixture and ignition setting. You also have to play with the boost controller. But anyhow just my opinion best of luck getting more dyno time. But no doubt your on a good note indicating your afr at W.O.T fall off to super rich after 4k rpm 10 afr and lower. Definitely something that need fiddling with the boost settings. Or if any case might have a possible clutch slippage failure Just my opinion.

Usually electronic boost controllers act up on dyno's, no matter what, because a dyno almost NEVER replicates real world load on an engine. Mess with the boost controller till you have it holding on the dyno, then just expect to reset it on the street to match the boost level on the dyno.

Yeah, your af/r is pretty junk, thats why you need an EMS. :duh:

[smelly240]

You don't need nawssss to get 300whp with an s15 spec r t28, just intake, cams, injectors, front mount, full exhaust and tuning

hes saying on a t25 300HP and on a t28 400HP... i also call bs.

[johngriff]

DoLuck is the most recent in a series of zilvia trolls.

Just look at his rep.

[smelly240]

But I know the rules... unless I find that sheet... it never happend.. :rolleyes:

it never happened.

[s14unimog]

try lowering the (gain) I usually set the psi/kpa/bar at 14.6/100/1.0 then -gain- 10% and up. It really depends, you must have some more dyno time to play with it to get that initial sweet spot. Most of the time tuning cars once your done playing with the af mixture and ignition setting. You also have to play with the boost controller. But anyhow just my opinion best of luck getting more dyno time. But no doubt your on a good note indicating your afr at W.O.T fall off to super rich after 4k rpm 10 afr and lower. Definitely something that need fiddling with the boost settings. Or if any case might have a possible clutch slippage failure Just my opinion.

I doubt that my clutch is slipping, my RPM's stay consistant all through a pull. I watched the boost fall off on my gage as it ran, thats why the power fell off. Now, to figure out why it won't hold that 14.

[smelly240]

mostly bc its a t25 and its huffin to make 12 let alone 14...

[lildrifter]

I took my car down yesterday and had it thrown on a Mustang dyno machine and put down 195rwhp and 195ft/lbs torque. This is with an apexi gt spec exhaust and at 10psi. Everything else is stock.
http://i511.photobucket.com/albums/s359/deadfoot2001/DSCN0120.jpg

[steve shadows]

Dyno dynamics read a couple percent even lower than mustangs.

go give big props to the guys running around with over 375-410 whp that I have tuned in the last couple weeks on the dyno dynamics. all be it with urine California additive laden gasoline (91) too.

[clv5045]

dude... stock boost is 7 psi...

Wastegate Spring is set at 7psi. Stock EBC (which most people don't bother hooking up during the swap) is set to 11psi (though it is adjustable). End of story.

[D.Adams]

Wastegate Spring is set at 7psi. Stock EBC (which most people don't bother hooking up during the swap) is set to 11psi (though it is adjustable). End of story.


didnt look at the thread date i see..