Apexi n1 dual vs. 5Zigen Fireball

[S14 Drgn]

I'm having a hard time deciding between these two.  I read previous posts on the topic but came up with no answer.  I'm planning on tuning my s14 totally NA, so I 'm looking and comparing na versions of both exhausts (with the proper piping of course).  

I love the look and sound of both so that's no issue, but which na version the exhaust (fireball or n1 dual) would give me more performance and be a better investment for my '95? thanks!

[grahams14]

What about the HKS Ti limited? The Apexi one is nice but can't find a pic of the 5Zigen one?

[S14 Drgn]

Danio's got one on his car. Check out his website.  I thought it was pretty impressive.  You'll definitely find pics there.

http://danio.nismo.org/catback.html

[BlankFlip]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from grahams14 on 3:42 pm on Jan. 8, 2002
What about the HKS Ti limited? The Apexi one is nice but can't find a pic of the 5Zigen one?</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
the 5zigen fireball exhaust looks similar to the apexi n1 (NOT dual n1) and has about 2.4&quot; piping for NA cars.

[S14 Drgn]

As for the HKS, yeah its nice but I really am looking at the n1 dual or the fireball for my taste. &nbsp;So can anyone help? please?

[vancouvers14]

http://www.zilvia.net/pages/review/240/images/dynoa.jpg
enough said

[grahams14]

What systems do you guys run on your s14s then. In the UK we tend mostly to fit Blitz NUR, HKS S.Drager and HKS Hipers, purely as they are sold in the UK. It is quite hard to get hold of a 5Zigen or Apexi and you tend to have to use Takakaira or someone and pay loads for it!!! <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('> My Hiper cost my £500 plus fitting, a Drager would cost about £650 and the Blitz somewhere in between. I hate to think how much the systems you are looking at would cost here. Sorry s14 drgn, wasn't trying to hijack your thread. :wink: &nbsp;

[anthony240]

well it's up to you, you want two tips or one? I just chose the N1 dual cause of it's dual tips.

[BlankFlip]

keep in mind that u can get 2.5&quot; piping then throw on a dual tip muffler.

[rabbit23]

i have the fireball. according to the butt dyno it made a huge difference. the car has a nice rumble and pulls hard to 6k (that's about as far as i usually go). i like the fact that it is only one single large output. it is almost a straight line from the cat back and hangs out the back at an angle. i don't have any pics but can tell you it looks mean. i don't know the differences in hp gain between the apex dual and the fireball but i think either is a good choice. it seems people with 240's are always caught in this dillema. the fireball comes in n/a form 2.38 inch piping, i am not sure if the dual comes in any other way than turbo.

[1stcar240sx]

I am also interested in the n1 dual (it looks cool). What are the prices and hp gains? &nbsp;I can't seem to find any sites with good info on diff. setups.
Thanks everybody

[sykikchimp]

where's a good place to get the entire Fireball exhaust.. &nbsp;I see just the muffler all over the place but no one has the whole thing???

[EVOtekS14bDIFter]

Definitely get the Apex-i. &nbsp;You can't lose with whichever one you have, but the dual N1s will be more streetable for your NA application. &nbsp;It will give you more HPs than the single N1, which I have. &nbsp;I like the looks of it more than the Fireball. &nbsp;If you're going turbo then I'd go with the single N1. &nbsp;Greddy will be coming out with a CARB legal turbo for the S14 so I'll be waiting for it and I already have the exhaust for it as well.

[rabbit23]

how can the dual be more streetable for n/a applications? i thought they have 3inch or larger piping? if you are sticking purely n/a you still need a little backpressure or you loose your low end a little. i do know that when i go turbo i am going to have to increase my diameter to 3inches but since i am n/a i can feel the gains all through the power band not just the topend. does the dual come in smaller dimensions than 3 inches? if you are telling someone to get the apex just because it looks better you are giving misinformation. sykikchimp i got mine through a local performance shop, they ordered the entire cat back. after seeing how easy it was to install i definatly think i could have done it my self, but they also did some cat work for me.

[NoTuchn]

i would definatley go the the 5zigen fireball!

[vancouvers14]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from sykikchimp on 2:19 am on Jan. 9, 2002
where's a good place to get the entire Fireball exhaust.. I see just the muffler all over the place but no one has the whole thing???
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

What you see everywhere is the Border Fireball muffler, not the 5zigen Fireball cat-back exhaust. &nbsp;Thats like comparing a Ferrari kit car built on a VW chassis to a reall Ferrari. &nbsp;Yes they look the same, but....

[sykikchimp]

AHHH .. &nbsp;I sEe said the blind man. &nbsp;I think I'm gonna go with the 5Zigen Fireball too.. &nbsp;I like the look. the performance gains I hear about sound nice too.

How much did you guys pay for yours?

[vancouvers14]

500US + shipping from autoimaging.com

[S14 Drgn]

I got a chance to talk to the guys at autoimaging (cool ppl by the way) they all have their 240s hooked up with firballs, but they said they all are running sr20dets under the hood. &nbsp;So the HP gains they have are on the turbo application ( I think). &nbsp;It would have been easier for me if I were going turbo to decide. I would definitely go with the dual then. But staying na, its a confusing deal.
has anyone found anything else yet by the way? any other dynos? BTW I am pretty sure they have a na application for n1 dual.

[EVOtekS14bDIFter]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from rabbit23 on 10:14 am on Jan. 9, 2002
how can the dual be more streetable for n/a applications? i thought they have 3inch or larger piping? if you are sticking purely n/a you still need a little backpressure or you loose your low end a little. i do know that when i go turbo i am going to have to increase my diameter to 3inches but since i am n/a i can feel the gains all through the power band not just the topend. does the dual come in smaller dimensions than 3 inches? if you are telling someone to get the apex just because it looks better you are giving misinformation. sykikchimp i got mine through a local performance shop, they ordered the entire cat back. after seeing how easy it was to install i definatly think i could have done it my self, but they also did some cat work for me.
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

The dual N1 is more streetable because the HP gains are mainly in the mid side of the powerband. &nbsp;I'm not really sure if the duals have 3&quot; piping, but if you look at the entryway towards the muffler from the cat, it forks into two different piping into the muffler making it dual. &nbsp;This affected the powerband to make it more streeable.
The single &nbsp;N1's power is mostly in the high end of the powerband. &nbsp;

[transient]

the n1 dual actually has smaller piping, meaning increased velocity, but since there are two pipes, it's still got a really high flow, so you basically get the best of both worlds.

[BlankFlip]

i've been seein so many numbers that i forgot the piping of the n1 dual (n/a). can somebody tell me.

[addiction]

so if i was planning for a turbo application which should i get? i like the look of the n1 but thats not the only thing i'm looking for. also, which one has larger pipe diameter?

[rabbit23]

i paid 600 installed, but also had other stuff done as well. but i remember danio paid like 450 or so? i don't really remember but i think it was under 500. i also believe 5zigen makes a turbo version of the cat back with close to 3 inch piping. does anybody have hp/dyno curve for the n-1's?

[EVOtekS14bDIFter]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from addiction on 1:19 pm on Jan. 10, 2002
so if i was planning for a turbo application which should i get? i like the look of the n1 but thats not the only thing i'm looking for. also, which one has larger pipe diameter?
</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

The N1 single has 3&quot; piping. &nbsp;If you're going turbo, the N1 single is a must, unless you don't want to be efficient and lose races when you should have won.

[IceTekGuy]

What is with everyone buying up these really expensive exhaust systems, at like 800.00$ and shit...

i got mine which is really nice(thermal research and development), 100.00$ for muffler and 80.00$ for pipes and highflow cat, with install, can't go wrong, ohh yea and it's 3&quot; inlet and outlet...

[tnord]

IceTek........in general, you pay for what you get

is that a stainless muffler/cat/piping?.........i'm guessing not

is it crush or mandrel bent?...........most likely crush

is the muffler louvered?........highly probable

is 3'' diamater ideal for a NA 2.4 liter?.......definitely no

did you gain any power from this modification?........i'd be very surprised if you did

then again, i don't know anything about thermal research products and i could be making a complete idiot of myself, but it's probably safe to say that if a pre-made system doesn't cost at least $300 it's junk

if all you care about is making noise and not power, just drill holes in you're muffler

[mistert]

thermal R&amp;D makes excellent products, their exhausts are very popular with honda people (doesnt mean they're crap!), because they have great flow but most importantly they dont sound like ass. they are available in a &quot;Stealth&quot; version as well, which drops the flow a little but sounds closer to stock

[tnord]

looks like i stand corrected..........although for that cheap i'm still skeptical

(Edited by tnord at 11:58 pm on Jan. 13, 2002)

[Danio]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">Quote: from rabbit23 on 3<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'>6 pm on Jan. 10, 2002
i paid 600 installed, but also had other stuff done as well. but i remember danio paid like 450 or so? i don't really remember but i think it was under 500.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Yeah I paid $450 for the Fireball catback and $25 for install. That was from a local shop.

These are the lowest prices I've seen online. Their difference is $1. =P I've never ordered from either of them before.

http://www.autocarparts.com
$494 (used to be on sale for $455)
$45 shipping

http://autoimaging.com
$500
$40 shipping

[anthony240]

IIRC, the N1 Dual starts off as a 2.75&quot; &nbsp;single pipe, then splits into two 2.5&quot; pipes, but the accurate measurements are in mm, so I'm not sure. The N1 dual is more of a turbo exhaust, due to the piping. Yes there is some midrange tourqe available, and so is high end. Like most large-diameter piping, most of the hp gain is at top end. But also because of the large piping, there is low end loss. The car lags, I can't get a quick start off the line. Maybe if I try a manual.

So if you're concrened about the low end lag, get the fireball. But if you plan on going turbo in the future, or don't care about low end, the dual is the way to go. Low end meaning 3k rpm and below.

[Takumi]

Do your N1 exhausts sound &quot;okay&quot;, meaning, not that loud that it'll disturb the neighbors? &nbsp;Or does it get to a point where people are screaming, &quot;AHHH! MY EARS ARE BLEEDING!&quot; like the Tanabe Racing Medallion?

[Thorpedo]

Im NA and have the n1 dual and i dont find it annoying at all. &nbsp; And just to add in the tolorance i do have...I cant stand my friends eclipse with just a muffler. &nbsp;Its obtrusively loud and mine is not even close to that annoying level. &nbsp; Aj from here has heard it, so has srskilladet.

[AJ]

It sounds like butter ;0 i love it. &nbsp;I'm set on getting one myself here pretty soon. &nbsp;I hate the sound of my car up at above 5g.. but with that n1 dual.. ooohh i'd be redlining it in ever gear just to hear it purr.

[S14 Drgn]

Thanks everyone for their input. I think I'm leaning toward the Firball. &nbsp;Just for comparison, AJ and Thorpedo, have you heard the Firball? &nbsp;Which is more louder/annoying: Fireball vs. N1 Dual?