How to tune with SAFC II?

[xpl2007]

Just want to see how some of you guys who know what they are doing tune your srs with a SAFC II? I know you can street tune before dyno runs to help out cut down on cost. I know you have to have a long straight and flat area.
What are some of your guys lows and highs, Low and High throttle, decel settings? What is your wideband readings at wot? What are your mods? Also what is your hp to the wheels?
Thanks heres mine:
S13 sr20det black valve cover, s15 turbo, 650 cc injectors, electric fans, FMIC, Trust down pipe 3.5" all the way back to muffler, Fuel pressure regulator set at 40psi while vacuum hose is off, HKS actuator set at 14psi, Blitz q45 air filter with q45 MAF, Wideband and SAFC II, Mines ECU stage 3, Good clutch. Oh 100 octane!!!

[Kouki]

What the hell is the mines ecu tuned for? If you have no idea, you'd better be getting rid of the safc and getting a standalone or romtune that is setup for exactly what you have.

[JohnC]

This thread might help you, but read all the way through it.
Ultimately, if money is at hand get a powerfc, haltech etc.
You are gonna get it anyway down the line so better to start with it.

http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?t=121488&highlight=safc

[xpl2007]

Figure id only want 300 hp but seems i have to get a Stand a lone like everyone was saying...

Mines ECU was tuned for my setup but for 550 injectors but i have 650... Stage 3 i think i the biggest set up.. Completely for my set up..

John i wish your were close i would like for you to look. My AFR during cruzzin is always 14.7-15 AFR.. WOT is 12-11 AFR... your excel diagram is the same for SAFC II diagram as you stated.. That helps or you could just look at the pre made chart ...

[wyteboichris]

http://www.ka-t.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8089&highlight=ultimate+safc+guide this should help if you haven't looked already... If you're using strictly an afc, there are always base settings to start with but it's basically trial and error for each specific set-up and car, just find where your car likes to be and run with it. GL

[xpl2007]

thanks i got the base just double checking.. Car should scream im sure i got a small boost leak some place. Do those boost leak testers work?

Thats a great forum but its all KAs...

[johngriff]

How to tune SAFC:

1 Install SAFC
2 Go to gas station
3 Pour Gasoline on car instead of in tank
4 Light Cigarette
5 Fire and Forget Tuning

[Chrischeezer]

How to tune SAFC:

1 Install SAFC
2 Go to gas station
3 Pour Gasoline on car instead of in tank
4 Light Cigarette
5 Fire and Forget Tuning

omfg.. u hurt my brain!! LOLOLOLOL

[wyteboichris]

thanks i got the base just double checking.. Car should scream im sure i got a small boost leak some place. Do those boost leak testers work?

Thats a great forum but its all KAs...

Sorry, i didn't notice you were SR. BTW, you can still scrounge up quite a few similar SR set ups in there. And as far as boost leak testers...i wouldn't know.

[johngriff]

http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578
http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578
http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578
http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578
http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578
http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578

[Irukandji]

John Griff to the rescue!

[xpl2007]

My car is getting [email protected]!!! Yes i know John you hate SAFC II i know stand alone i know Haltech. I am trying to see what you have built or have done to view your opinons. Yes i know stand a lone is the best... Why would APEX a million dollar company make SAFC II if there not good though?

[gt3071r240]

place in garbage buy an ems, just as john said. . .my car was tuned with an safc 2 orginally by AMS, the huge dsm shop, and it lasted for 1200 miles before I had a 1 inch portion of ring land missing on the #3 Cylinder. AGAIN THROW AWAY!

[WizardBlack]

S-AFC works just fine. Broken ring lands could just be too much power. What did your plugs look like? Your bearings?
SAFC works great as a touch up to a flashed or near stock vehicle which the OP has.
Standalones work for project/weekend/race cars or daily drivers only if the owner knows how to tune.
AEM works great but is unnecessary. You are only using the AFC to tweak the fuel in lieu of a touchup to the ECU by Mine's (which would be ridiculously expensive, obviously).

[xpl2007]

Yeah my real Silvia KS ran super hard and everyone told be on a stock format 15 psi was way to much. Ran 100 ocatane drifted it all the time and touge never had anyprobs. Again i would not half to punch it to make boost or power. I just give half throttle and sometime puch it to get the boost up then let off. Never had anyprobs for the whole year drifting on it.. But why would Apex make a piece of shit SAFC II? I know it works longs as you know what your doing. I will go stand a lone. For $1500 i can buy another 240sx. If i was to get a stand a lone i would have a rb26dett in my car instead of a sr. Why would i spend $1500 on my sr to get 300 maybe plus hp? When a rb26dett would destroy it? I just want 300whp for this car. My next 240 i will do stan a lone for sure with the rb26...

[WizardBlack]

Uh yeah. $1500 for standalone. Add another hundred or two for the proper sensors. Of course you must have a wideband, too.
Come to think of it, you should just buy a wideband and forgo the shop tune as long as you can follow instructions.

[xpl2007]

I got the PLX wideband John said to get. Its the right one... But what im thinking now is all this for a sr and a daily?

[WizardBlack]

I got the PLX wideband John said to get. Its the right one... But what im thinking now is all this for a sr and a daily?
Yeah it'll work great and once you know how the wideband should read it provides a lot of insurance and peace of mind.

[johngriff]

Steve and I decided last night over some beers we will be co-authoring an article on why/what out big psychotic obsession with certain systems, types of tunning etc.

Basically, since you have no timing control, you could be detonating, or you could be making less power, probably both. The AFC controls the timing in a backhanded way. You dont "break ring lands" by simply "making too much power". Hard parts break, when you detonate. If you were making too much power, you would be looking at cylinder heads lifting or rods bending before a piston takes a chunk out and eats itself.

Why would apexi make the afc? To sell out. They must have sold 10000 times more AFC's than power fc's over the years. It works, for 1992, but now its just a continuiation of a dead form of tuning.

I am not on here to plug haltech directly. If you buy a haltech, you should probably know why you need the features you are paying such a large sum of money for. There IS a middle ground.

Emanage, PFC (i hate), and there are some cool ecu's comming out of austrailia that let you tune in realtime/laptop like a rom tune, for half the price of a used pfc now. I forgot the name, i'll get a link later.

My statement stands that; you must have full control over the timing map, and feedback data from a dyno to have a safe and powerfull tune. AF/R is fine and dandy, but 10.6-11.6 makes almost no to small changes in power when compared to tuning the timing.

I don't know who "SOLD" everyone that your AF/R was the most important first, and that ignition timing was something to be laughed at/off.

unnnggg i need to get back to work.

[xpl2007]

Thanks i think so to. So if not haltech then PFC would be ok? Whats the name of the Australians laptop thingy?

[johngriff]

I'll find out this week, seriously screw the pfc, i would take the emanage any day before that thing.

[xpl2007]

Ok thanks John i make sense out of things and this makes sense to me, so much i went out and tuned for my fuel pressure to work more then the SAFC II. Since i got the Mines ecu it should work the only thing killing it is the 650cc injectors instead of 550cc wich the ecu is programed for. So i i realy wanted to make my maf work and slight tune and i did the math and all my lows are slightly touched now.low 0,3,3,3,3,3,3,3 hi -16 all the way wich makes it run like 550ccs. I know the timing is knock is all fkd up not perfect but my reading are 0 on knock. This is the most i can tune without the SAFC II screwing shit up.... I am happy im letting the Mines work.. ITs super fast. I went to get my 100 octane but no one was around so ill go tomorrow im on 91 yeah!!! lol All my AFR at low are 14.7, and wot is 12.5-11.5..... Thanks John.!!!

[WizardBlack]

Steve and I decided last night over some beers we will be co-authoring an article on why/what out big psychotic obsession with certain systems, types of tunning etc.

Basically, since you have no timing control, you could be detonating, or you could be making less power, probably both. The AFC controls the timing in a backhanded way. You dont "break ring lands" by simply "making too much power". Hard parts break, when you detonate. If you were making too much power, you would be looking at cylinder heads lifting or rods bending before a piston takes a chunk out and eats itself.

Why would apexi make the afc? To sell out. They must have sold 10000 times more AFC's than power fc's over the years. It works, for 1992, but now its just a continuiation of a dead form of tuning.

I am not on here to plug haltech directly. If you buy a haltech, you should probably know why you need the features you are paying such a large sum of money for. There IS a middle ground.

Emanage, PFC (i hate), and there are some cool ecu's comming out of austrailia that let you tune in realtime/laptop like a rom tune, for half the price of a used pfc now. I forgot the name, i'll get a link later.

My statement stands that; you must have full control over the timing map, and feedback data from a dyno to have a safe and powerfull tune. AF/R is fine and dandy, but 10.6-11.6 makes almost no to small changes in power when compared to tuning the timing.

I don't know who "SOLD" everyone that your AF/R was the most important first, and that ignition timing was something to be laughed at/off.

unnnggg i need to get back to work.

The world (and Apex) don't revolve around the SR20DET. There are plenty of ECU's out there that can handle well into 400+ whp with a mere S-AFC. Many factory turbo ECU's have stellar knock/timing control and do their thing right without a standalone. You just need an AFC to help it along a bit with different injectors, MAF, etc. etc. On the flip side, some cars only need timing, true. But a kid that doesn't know a whole lot and isn't asking for a whole lot buying a Haltech or AEM is foolhardy. As the OP stated, they just want a tad more horsepower and it won't take a standalone to do the job. Sledgehammer instead of a flyswatter kind of thing. But, to each his own.

[xpl2007]

no your right and i totaly agree if i were to spend $1500 on any stand alone i would not have a sr i would have a rb26dett making at leat 500 to the wheels... And no BS i can get one right now but this is my 11th 240sx and i had a real Silvia if i had a little bit more power then my silvia then i am happy drifting freeway on adn off ramps with no problesm then imagine now.. SO the SAFC can do it but i dont want way out timming or relying on knock. The bad is we live here there are tons of things we having even seen for our sr20dets.. Im waiting to hear about this laptop controller for $500 in another country.. I will get that one...
Thanks

[johngriff]

The world (and Apex) don't revolve around the SR20DET. There are plenty of ECU's out there that can handle well into 400+ whp with a mere S-AFC. Many factory turbo ECU's have stellar knock/timing control and do their thing right without a standalone. You just need an AFC to help it along a bit with different injectors, MAF, etc. etc. On the flip side, some cars only need timing, true. But a kid that doesn't know a whole lot and isn't asking for a whole lot buying a Haltech or AEM is foolhardy. As the OP stated, they just want a tad more horsepower and it won't take a standalone to do the job. Sledgehammer instead of a flyswatter kind of thing. But, to each his own.

Your statement kind of makes me think you didn't read my post.

BulletPoint Style

Fuel- To keep it cool, burn, make power
Timing, to make peak output, careful control = more power
heat- kills engines
safc = massacare of the timing map
there are more options, if you dont understand what and why you need it, yeah dont buy it

[xpl2007]

John did you find out i sent you a pm on a greddy emanage ultimate... Should i get>?

[xpl2007]

Guess no on all my questions. Dont know if you check your pm or even zilvia.net??