Audio questions

[Gjohnson7]

Alright guys, I know were all about performance and systems weight us down, but I have a question about speaker fitment. For short period of time I will have the hook up on some stereo equipment and I'm trying to figure out what to put in my S13 rebuild. I'm planning on going with either the Alpine IDA-X001 or the Pioneer DEH-7900B for my head unit. But I can't figure out what speakers to run in the door. I've tried all the 4 x 6 crap and it just plain sucks, so what are you guys running in the doors. I'm starting to lean toward a nice 6 1/2 component set, but I really didn't want to have to buy an amp. (guess you have to do what you gotta do)

Suggestions and experience???

By the way, I'm planning on using my 30 gig Ipod video for most music. I realize the Alpine doesn't play cd's. (even though that's kinda weird!)

Alright, help a brotha out!


Sorry, it's not like we have a Audio section.

[98koukile]

I wanna switch to that headunit and a cd changer. I'd go 6.5 components and an amp

[TheTimanator]

there was a thread similar to this a few months ago.

Anyway, I've never heard a good sound sound system in an S13. I have 5.25's up front and I have heard of people cramming 6.5's in there. Whatever you do components are your best bet. If I were to start over I would have figured out a way to put 6.5's in.

[smurfgcr]

is it hatch? if it is, do you have the rear panel that attaches to it and covers the trunk? its a decent spot to put speakers along with the door. they're just lightning audio, but they get the job done

[Gjohnson7]

Yeah its a hatch. Hmmmm Hadn't thought about that trunk cover.

So anyone that has done it, what is required to fit the 6.5's?????

[sal240sx]

Id say take a look at the Pioneer DEH-P6900UB. Its cheaper and has the same crap. Also, check out mjmautoinnovations. They have 6.5" adapter plates.

[projectRDM]

You can make an MDF or ABS baffle to hold a 6.5" speaker in the door easily, there's plenty of room.

[CKAMC]

Componet 6.5's up front are a must! Angle the tweakers on the a-pillar

There is enough space to fit some fairly deep 6.5's in the front, if you dont like that rattle from the bass with your doors then try and stick with 6.5's that dont sink in too much.

[BustedS13]

6.5's all around. components if you can afford them. done.

[Frixco_240]

I'd say skip the 6.5's and keep the 4x6's. 6.5's are not necessary. Get infinity kappa's on all 4 corners and no system is complete unless you have a sub. On a hatch, 1 12 is good enough since there is no trunk, you would get the bass really really well, because it's all open into the cabin. For the amp, you can mount 2 on the back seat panels. 1 4 channel amp for speakers and 1x 1 channel for the sub. Wiring for the subs can run along door sills then under back seat. Wiring on a hatch is the easiest thing. Now remember if you do get a 12, dont get a box that's too big other wise you cant put the hatch cover on. that happened to me and my shit got jacked. So instead I went with 2 10's and it was just fine compared to the 12.

[BustedS13]

I'd say skip the 6.5's and keep the 4x6's. 6.5's are not necessary.

and no system is complete unless you have a sub.

jesus, did you go to some sort of incompetence school?

[s13gold]

i've got 6.5" mb quart components all around. expensive but damn well worth it.

[Frixco_240]

jesus, did you go to some sort of incompetence school?

no, but there's no need for 6.5's and having to buy brackets and what not when a set of good 4x6's will bolt right on and does the job fine. Also, if you're going to crank up the music, a subwoofer is definately better. Unless you have 6x9's, other speakers will not hold up to alot of bass. I'm just giving my 2 cents and if you don't like it don't read it and you don't have to follow what I say exactly. I can say that you went to some incompetence school for putting 6.5's on an s13 when it is't necessary but I didn't, so calm down, I'm just trying to give advice.

[CKAMC]

in the rear of a hatch upgraded 4x6's are just fine(like infinity reference series)... come on now its rare for any of us to have someone sit back there...

unless your a tall fucker that somehow finds yourself sitting far back enough to be able to hear the rear speakers.

S13 Coupe? Yeah 6.5 rears. Dont ask me about s14's since I have never owned one.

[cdlong]

screw the rear speakers, screw the amp, screw the sub. adding speakers to the hatch cover will just add noise, not sound. just get a good head unit and a good 6.5" component set for the doors. it's simple and if you get a headunit with decent power and a good set of speakers with low resistance and good bass, it will sound pretty good.

i had a set of 5.25" components in the doors and 4x6s in the back of my old s13 and it sounded really good, you couldn't even hear the rear speakers.

[Jpooks_S13]

I'd say skip the 6.5's and keep the 4x6's. 6.5's are not necessary. Get infinity kappa's on all 4 corners and no system is complete unless you have a sub. On a hatch, 1 12 is good enough since there is no trunk, you would get the bass really really well, because it's all open into the cabin. For the amp, you can mount 2 on the back seat panels. 1 4 channel amp for speakers and 1x 1 channel for the sub. Wiring for the subs can run along door sills then under back seat. Wiring on a hatch is the easiest thing. Now remember if you do get a 12, dont get a box that's too big other wise you cant put the hatch cover on. that happened to me and my shit got jacked. So instead I went with 2 10's and it was just fine compared to the 12.


components will sound way better than the kappa plates..a 12 isnt nessecary ethier i have rockford 10'' p1 and it suplies plenty bass and sounds great..the wireing is much cleaner and just as easy to take up the center counsol and run it under the carpet and right under the back seat.
and for a box being too tall..just get crafty and makeone yourself or if you dont know waht you are doing have one built its not super expensive.

[D1GP]

no, but there's no need for 6.5's and having to buy brackets and what not when a set of good 4x6's will bolt right on and does the job fine.

that is fine if all you want is bass and crap for sq. if you want sound quality, 6.5 components are the way to go.

[Gjohnson7]

I'm leaning on picking up the Pioneer DEH-7900B. It's a solid headunit, that offers built in Bluetooth.( which is too hott!) Right now I'm just planning on picking up a set of Alpine Components and a cheap amp. I'm not really looking for a whole lot of bass these days. Although, I do have some old kicker comp vr's hanging out in my garage. Who know, I might thow a single 12 in sometime down the line, but for right now I think just a set 6.5 set of components in the doors will be fine.

Thanks guys

[cdlong]

not to mention the big hole you'll have in the soundfield with 4x6s and a 12".

[KA-T_240]

I have some clarion 4x6s in the stock locations with a alpine CD player. the sound is ok, lots of highs. not enought bass for me.

I am going to add either a 10 or a 12 inch RE audio XXX and an amp from US amps. I am going to redo the rear hatch part and get a custom fiberglass box what is all held in and wired with stuff that is "quick connected" so i can take it in and out in like 5min for racing.

[s13rookie]

screw the rear speakers, screw the amp, screw the sub. adding speakers to the hatch cover will just add noise, not sound. just get a good head unit and a good 6.5" component set for the doors. it's simple and if you get a headunit with decent power and a good set of speakers with low resistance and good bass, it will sound pretty good.

i had a set of 5.25" components in the doors and 4x6s in the back of my old s13 and it sounded really good, you couldn't even hear the rear speakers.

Most GOOD component sets can not run properly on the 18-26 watts rms a deck puts out. the "65x4" or whatever is plastered on the face is useless.


I have some clarion 4x6s in the stock locations with a alpine CD player. the sound is ok, lots of highs. not enought bass for me.

I am going to add either a 10 or a 12 inch RE audio XXX and an amp from US amps. I am going to redo the rear hatch part and get a custom fiberglass box what is all held in and wired with stuff that is "quick connected" so i can take it in and out in like 5min for racing.

By "quick connected" do you mean "easily stolen"? Look into your system pics a bit more. the XXX will tear apart a f/g box. Also its not a sound quality sub at all, so i imagine youre going for the spl? Look at the size requirements of a properly built vented box, May not fit in the hatch even with using the tire well. Also, are you prepared for the current draw of a US amp? I dont know if they started making class d but the a/b class amps they used to make were hogs, not really something a stock 240 alt could handle on a daily basis

[cdlong]

Most GOOD component sets can not run properly on the 18-26 watts rms a deck puts out. the "65x4" or whatever is plastered on the face is useless.

true, but i ran a set of infinity kappas off a cheap JVC headunit and it could crank out some decent tunes. "high quality" components usually have a lower sensetivity and more power draw but if you aren't going for primo sound quality, some decent components can perform pretty well.

[BustedS13]

if money is a factor, then don't buy big box store brands. actually, don't do that anyway, rockford and brands like that tend to be garbage.

power your speakers. internal amps are useless. the RMS on them is always like 15 watts. that's nothing. people always assume the "55x4" means 55 watts RMS x 4. it doesn't. it means 55 watts max power per channel. that means you're underpowering your aftermarket speakers. and that means they sounds like butthole. get an amp, at least for the front speakers.

as far as the argument for just getting a good pair of door speakers... i'm sure that sounds fine for some people. but putting a pair of speakers in your hatch cover does NOT "just add noise". the sound reverberates off the rear glass and provides plenty of sound. i'd, at the very least, throw a cheap set of plate speakers in the factory location just for some rear "fill", and then spend significantly more money on the door speakers.

back to brands.
head units: i like Pioneer. i like Pioneer a lot. i've had a pioneer deck for about 7 years that has refused to die, no matter how many cars i put it in. i also like Kenwood and Alpine. great sound quality, cheap prices (online). for head units, i really prefer the big box brands. you could get an Eclipse, but you won't hear the difference. especially if you think running off the internal amp is a good idea. brands to avoid: Sony. ugh.

speakers: Crystal makes some great speakers, for very small prices. excellent quality. Memphis is pretty good too. a more common brand i like is MB Quart, but only with silk tweeters. the titanium ones sound awful. brands to avoid: Sony, Rockford Fosgate.

subs: if you must. Diamond makes the clearest hitting subwoofer for the price. Orion isn't half bad either. but try out some powered door speakers first and see if that's enough. it should be, unless your 240 rolls on hydros. and if it does, you're pretty gay. and probably from california. brands to avoid: the usual. Rockford, Sony.

amps: Hifonics. these amps cost nothing and are ultra clear. i also like Phoenix Gold. i had a Tantrum amp that was supposed to put out 1200 watts into one channel max, but actually capped at about 1500 watts. it was awesome. when i was 17. not now. get a Hifonics amp to cover your door speakers. to avoid: Sony, Kenwood. kenwood makes some seriously shitty amps.

[S14DB]

My head unit gets hot as hell trying to drive the components I put in. I have 6ch out and need to get an amp. Where would you recommend buying a Hifonics? I hate most of the local places so, online.

[CKAMC]

for head unit's I would like to add eclipse to the list

for speakers its hard to beat infinity for the more common/cheaper brand sector, polk, boston acoustic, and JBL are also something else to consider.

amps: I have only delt and ran one brand (MTX), anything else i have yet to hear about or know. I have only tried to push components so I have delt with 4 channel amps for the most part.

[98koukile]

If you want rear speakers I believe R240NA put them in his rear side panels and that's what I plan on doing in the near future... components of course

[KA-T_240]

I know what is needed/well my audio guy does. I trust what he is doing. He has been doing it for ever. I never turn my system all the way up, i just like over kill so it does not break when i push it. I like quality over spl. I have heard the products and love the performance and quality.

i dont worry about getting shit stolen it doesnt happen. My car is getting to the point where it is rarely driven, stuff would have gotten jacked already.

[BustedS13]

My head unit gets hot as hell trying to drive the components I put in. I have 6ch out and need to get an amp. Where would you recommend buying a Hifonics? I hate most of the local places so, online.

definitely ebay. i'm actually about to buy some equipment for my 240, since everything that was in it has been cannibalized for other cars that have since been sold.

some might whine that you're not going to get a warranty buying online. i say if you're buying decent equipment, then you shouldn't really have to worry. besides, you'll have a helluva time proving you didn't burn something up due to user error. also, considering how much you're saving, you could burn up an amp and buy another, and still be spending less than if you had bought an amp retail with a warranty or replacement plan.

[chuonthis]

I'm planning on going with either the Alpine IDA-X001 or the Pioneer DEH-7900B for my head unit.
Have you looked at the new Alpine CDA-9887? The retail price is the same as the IDA-X001 but it has lots more settings to play with:

CDA-9887 vs. IDA-X001
CD player vs. no CD player
bio-lite display vs. 2.2" color LCD
ipod connection vs. ipod and usb connection
7 band EQ vs. bass and treble controls
4V pre-outs vs. 2V pre-outs
built-in crossovers vs. nothing
time correction vs. nothing
full face is detachable vs. only left side is detachable

[CKAMC]

The deck of CD deck's
http://www.eclipse-web.com/cd/cd7100overviews.html
8V pre-out!!!

[GSXRJJordan]

I just read most of this, thinking "oh shit this is going to be another blind-leading-the-blind 240sx audio thread", until BustedS13 came in and said everything I'd say (well, most of it).

I hate 4x6's. They're fucking useless, unless you free-air mount an 8" somewhere to fill in.

Let me start by saying I used to be very interested in IASCA SQ, and built a great VW Golf to compete with under the direction of a guy named Devin Oliver that builds some of the best car amplifiers money can buy... www.trutechnology.com (http://www.trutechnology.com). I have a very decent system in my S13. Total $ is around $1200. That's NOTHING as far as SQ systems are concerned. I built this system to be small, inexpensive, and efficient.

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/9353/hpim0111qr4.jpg

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/8097/hpim0110qx9.jpg

In the first shot you can see the fiberglass door panel for my CDT 6.5" woofers, part of a custom set I put together - basically I got a mid-range component set (HD-series), and upgraded to their top-of-the-line crossover (CDT EX-560i) and their top-of-the-line silk 1" tweeter (CDT TW-25). I've got Dynamat lining the inside of the pod all the way into the door to reduce vibration and let the 6.5"s play all the way down to 250hz or so.

The second shot shows the tweeter mounted in the A pillar, pointed to play off the windshield. This takes care of the front soundstage VERY well. I run a potentiometer to dial in tweeter gain for windows up/down.

With my hookup, I can get this same component setup for you guys for <$400/set. Possibly much less.

My head unit's a mid-range Alpine - if you're serious about audio and don't want to run a line driver, don't get an Alpine. Pre-outs are kind of weak (although they claim to be 5v). I recommend Kenwood. Don't believe published pre-outs - ask around on caraudioforums/etc about which head units have the cleanest output, and buy accordingly.

I don't have any pictures of the back, but it's a 1.75 ft^3 vented box I built out of 3/4" MDF that's 12.5" tall (so it fits under my rear deck) and has about 5" of clearance on both sides between the strut towers (bass needs space to travel through to the cabin), and houses my Image Dynamics IDMax 10" and Arc Audio Foose Designs 4150 (conservatively rated at 80W RMSx4 @ 4ohms, so about 200W bridged into my 4ohm IDMax). I'll have to get some pics up. My first setup was a super cheap Soundstream SQ10" and Soundstream Rubicon 40w RMSx4, and sounded really good. As long as you go with clean power and a SQ-oriented (and therefore efficient) woofer, your bass will be very clean and sound good ALL THE TIME.

Long story short, you need:
- 6.5" drivers up front, and a door pod that points them at the opposing seat's head is ideal (and easy to make). If you're interested, I'll tell ya how to do it. Notice I don't have any rear speakers - don't need em.
- 10" sub for SQ, 12" sub for SPL. Good subs w/good power sound good, bad subs or good subs with bad power sound like ass. If you don't know what you're doing, contact me for build specs and I'll help you make a sealed box for your sub. Point it straight back, sitting against your strut tower bar.
- Decent 4ch amp. I can help you find something. Like BustedS13 said, Hifonics and Phoenix Gold make good sounding (and decently efficient) amps at GREAT prices.

I "bolded" all the equipment for skimmers. Anyone in the LA area can come hear my system if you're interested in great sound. If you like big boom in the trunk, mine'll do that too, but I don't let it :) PM me for any tips/tricks, I'd love to improve the 240sx community's audio setups.

[Dream240]

I am currently running Infinity reference 4x6" in the rear, 6 1/2" Kappas in the front with the eBay brackets, a Pioneer 8400 head unit, and a 300W 4-CH amp mounted on the back of the rear seat. All wiring going along the door sills.

I gotta say when it comes to sound quality, Infinity has been the best bang for my buck. I've gone through Pioneer, Sony, Jensen, and couple others over the years, and the crispness of the sound with absolutely no distortion (so far) makes them easily my best experience with speakers. I am running about 60 RMS to each speaker so with practially no GAIN and maxed out bass/trebile, even the references pump out pure sound. And both sets make great bass for their size.

The only problem I've been having is cleaning up the interior vibrations caused from the bumping. I get a new one about every 2 months.

Just a side note: All 3 of my Pioneer decks I've owned over the years have developed CD eject issues where eventually they won't come out at all. My current one sometimes requires me to use tweezers to get the CD out!! Also for some reason they don't like playing RIP mp3 music. I get horrid static troughout all tracks when I try this.

For head units the best I've owned has been Panasonic. I love their interfaces and the online support is unmatched. I also like how most of the higher end units have the motorized face, Pioneers don't. And Panasonics blue LED looks waaay sweeter than Pioneer's by far.

Hope this helps.

[GSXRJJordan]

^^^ Yeah I've had good success with Panasonic head units also. I still caution to read about the actual tested outputs from each head unit, rather than 'advertised', but yeah Panasonics ~$300 range is hard to beat. And who doesn't like blue LEDs?

Infinity "reference" speakers are their low end. I don't want anyone to go out thinking they're going to get "audiophile" sound from a $80 component. Not bad for a rear fill though, not tryin to bash your system. The Kappa components in the front are alright, a little bright/tinny. CDT's are a better buy in my opinion.