I need new struts :(

[Natty]

Ok, so my mystery steering wheel "shimmy" is still there. The balancing only softened it.
The guys said I need new tires (I knew that) and new struts all around. He wanted like $500 just for the suspension with labor, so I am goign to *try* this myself.
So, my questions:
Is this a doable job? What has to be removed and how hard is it to reinstall?
What struts do I get? I do not need anything performance. Would OEM be good? Should I get new stock springs too?
Thanks,
Jeff

[Da808aZnRaVr]

yes replacing your own struts is very doable...as long as u have the right tools...how much u willin to spend on new struts?...OEM would be fine but why not jus get new springs and struts and drop your car?

[uiuc240]

Before you just jump into this, can you tell us a little bit more about what parts you've replace on your suspension.  TC bushings wear out and make a shimmy.  Worn tie rod ends could cause a shimmy.  I'm not saying it's NOT the struts, but I would hate to see you shell out a bunch of cash and not have it fix your problem (like I did)....

Eric

[tnord]

how do struts cause a shimmy? as far as i knew, they only controlled up and down motion.

[uiuc240]

struts are a bearing point in our suspensions, and they are allowed to pivot during steering. &nbsp;if completely trashed, they could affect the steering in such a way that it would cause a shimmy...however, the struts would be totally blown and the ride would suck too. &nbsp;this is why i'm skeptical &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'> . &nbsp;shops like to replace shocks/struts...it's easy and they make lots of money doing it. &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/mad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':angry:'>

so, like i asked before, what other suspension parts, have you replaced natty? &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/notify.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':notify:'>

Eric

[240 2NR]

Have you ever seen a car with dead struts on the highway? &nbsp;The wheel just kind of bounces uncontrolably and I would imagine that could translate back to the steering wheel as a shimmy if they were that bad.

My car has had just about every connection point in the front end replaced (TC bushing, LCA bushing and ball joint, tie rod ends, springs and struts) and I still have some shimmy in my wheel on the right road surfaces. &nbsp;I think S13's just do that.

[uiuc240]

what speed, steve?

cuz there's a service bulletin about a 55-65 shimmy that requires the replacement of some $7 plastic piece in the steering rack or something. &nbsp;check it out.

Eric

[tnord]

man, they would have to be really f'd. i've driven on blown struts before, and i didn't notice a "shimmy." it was more like uncontrollable bouncing. i suppose if you couldn't tell the difference between a shimmy and the wheel getting airborn, then i could be a shimmy.

[uiuc240]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ Aug. 13 2002,11:04)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">man, they would have to be really f'd. i've driven on blown struts before, and i didn't notice a "shimmy." it was more like uncontrollable bouncing. i suppose if you couldn't tell the difference between a shimmy and the wheel getting airborn, then i could be a shimmy.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
exactly. &nbsp;and yet again, i think this shop is just trying to make some easy money. &nbsp;i bet he either needs new TC bushings or MABYE a set of LCA bushings or MAYBE new tie rod ends. &nbsp;my money's on the TC bushings.

Eric

[Natty]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (uiuc240 @ Aug. 12 2002,12:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteBegin--tnord+Aug. 13 2002,11<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ Aug. 13 2002,11<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'>4)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">man, they would have to be really f'd. i've driven on blown struts before, and i didn't notice a "shimmy." it was more like uncontrollable bouncing. i suppose if you couldn't tell the difference between a shimmy and the wheel getting airborn, then i could be a shimmy.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
exactly. and yet again, i think this shop is just trying to make some easy money. i bet he either needs new TC bushings or MABYE a set of LCA bushings or MAYBE new tie rod ends. my money's on the TC bushings.

Eric</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Thanks for all the replies.
I went in to a franchise "Tires Plus" place just to get a quick tire balance, in hopes that it would solve my steering wheel shimmy. It helped a bit...
Any ways, I knew my tires were bad. The shop guy said I needed new struts as well though. I don;t think the two are related.
I'll take it to a real shop to check everything out for the shimmy. The Tires Plus guy said that new struts were needed to stop from qucikly killing my tires which were cupping.
As for performance struts, I don't drive hard enough to justify the extra cash.
Jeff

[uiuc240]

read this webpage:

tire wear (http://www.autoshop-online.com/cchtml/tire.wr.prob.html)

i just googled it.

Eric

[Natty]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (uiuc240 @ Aug. 12 2002,12:12)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteBegin--tnord+Aug. 13 2002,11<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (tnord @ Aug. 13 2002,11<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wow.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':0'>4)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">man, they would have to be really f'd. i've driven on blown struts before, and i didn't notice a "shimmy." it was more like uncontrollable bouncing. i suppose if you couldn't tell the difference between a shimmy and the wheel getting airborn, then i could be a shimmy.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
exactly. and yet again, i think this shop is just trying to make some easy money. i bet he either needs new TC bushings or MABYE a set of LCA bushings or MAYBE new tie rod ends. my money's on the TC bushings.

Eric</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
How can you tell if the TC rods, TC bushings, tie rod, or tie rod bushings are bad? Anything I can see, visually or feel for?
Jeff

[Powerzen2002]

Hmmm... im having the same problem now as well. &nbsp;At exactly 55 MPH ... the wheel starts to give a hard shimmy shake feeling. &nbsp;Like 2 really unbalanced tires. &nbsp;Also, &nbsp;the front ride is a little more bumpy than it used to be.

anybody know if KYB's are good struts? &nbsp;cuz if i need new ones, i want good ones... screw OEM's! &nbsp;Also, somebody said to me that since it is rear wheel drive, its possible to have a bad rear mimic a front end balance problem. &nbsp;Is this true as well? thank you.

[uiuc240]

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Natty @ Aug. 13 2002,7:50)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">How can you tell if the TC rods, TC bushings, tie rod, or tie rod bushings are bad? Anything I can see, visually or feel for?
Jeff</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
TC rods are solid, they should be fine unless you drift into a curb and bend one <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'>

TC bushings are fairly easy to check for failure. &nbsp;They will dry, crack, and leak an oozy goo. &nbsp;Time for new ones...you can get polyurethane for a nice upgrade.

Tie rod ends can be checked for "play" by jacking up the front end, grabbing on to the wheel/tire at 9 & 3 position and wiggling hard. &nbsp;If you can feel any movement, replace them.

Eric

[240 2NR]

Tie rods ends can also have the boot fail, in which case the boot will dry out and split, leaking out the grease (more common on the passenger side in any region with a real winter). They may still function properly, but will be rapidly deteriorating as once the grease has leaked out they are no longer fully lubricated and probably full of dirt and grit.

[Powerzen2002]

Well, I just got my mechanic to look at my front end.

My bushings on my tie rods are SHOT!!! on both sides. &nbsp;I hope that is the ONLY cause of my shimmy wheel. &nbsp;Gonna run me 60 bucks a strut bar from NISSAN cuz there is no aftermarket. &nbsp;Is this true = "The busshings alone can not be replaced, you need to replace the whole strut it self". &nbsp;He only charging me 200 bucks to do both strut bars 'n bushings. &nbsp;I would assume this is a 500 dollar job to do both sides. &nbsp;Any opinions on this is a good deal? &nbsp;Also, is it true on a 1990 240sx the bushings alone can not be replaced?

Thanks!

[uiuc240]

you're messing up all the names. &nbsp;do you mean the Tension Control Rod bushings are shot? &nbsp;and what "strut bar" are you talking about...those aren't stock from Nissan. &nbsp;and if you mean the "strut bearing plate" those can be replaced...with Nismo parts, even. &nbsp;you need to repost and clarify what you mean because I have no idea what parts you are actually talking about. &nbsp;If you don't know the real names, describe the shape and location of the part or include pics if possible.

Eric

[Powerzen2002]

Ok, im pretty sure its the TC bushings that are shot! &nbsp;The strut bar I am talking about is the Rods that are attatched to the actual bushings. &nbsp;Sorry for the wrong terminology. &nbsp;Maybe I am wrong bout which bushings, but the bushings if they are not the TC bushings please let me know. &nbsp;The bushings are at the inner end of a tie rod.

[uiuc240]

yep. &nbsp;TC bushings. &nbsp;Get new ones. &nbsp;Shimmy solved. &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

Eric

[Powerzen2002]

Question ... its not possible to just replace the bushings? &nbsp;
I brought it to a friend of mine (who does side work), he said that you cant just replace the bushings. &nbsp;You need to replace the tie rod assemble. &nbsp;He is charging me 200 bucks to do passenger and driver side tie rods. &nbsp;I know these nissan tie rods are VERY expensive. &nbsp;So, Im guessing this is a good price!? &nbsp;

Any comments? &nbsp;Thank you. &nbsp;

P.S. &nbsp;I am going to need an alignment done to right?

[uiuc240]

those bushings are hard to replace. &nbsp;you need a nice press to get them out, or you have to burn the rubber out and cut the metal part of the bushing out after that. &nbsp;this is a WELL-DOCUMENTED repair. &nbsp;search for all the info you need...if not here, at FreshAlloy.com. &nbsp;you can get replacement polyurethane bushings from Whiteline from www.pdm-racing.com. &nbsp;then get this friend of yours to pop them in for you. &nbsp;

you should not need an alignment after this, unless you had one done while the bushings were messed up.

Eric

[240 2NR]

TC bushings fit in the end of TC rods.

Tie rod ends go on the ends of tie rods and are part of the steering system.

If it is in fact TC bushings you are replacing (4" diameter bushing), with a nissan bushing then yes, they are not sold seperately. &nbsp;If you want to use a polyurethene bushing which will be stiffer and less prone to failure (it's solid as opposed to liquid filled) then those can be bought seperate, but will require a machine shop to press out the old bushings and push in the new (~$30).

For parts look to www.PDM-racing.com &nbsp;They even have pictures of what you are looking for. &nbsp;It's an easy swap that shouldn't require an alignment, and I wouldn't pay $200 for it unless you were getting parts included in that price. &nbsp;It's about a 1 hour job.

[240 2NR]

I=I=======O
TC rod TC bushing


WVWV-------==O
bellows/ tie rod/ tie rod end
(ball joint with rubber boot on &nbsp;threaded rod)

[uiuc240]

yes, quick job. &nbsp;true. &nbsp;but lame if you can't find a shop to press the bushings for you...some people have trouble with that part.

Eric

[240 2NR]

http://nismoparts.safeshopper.com/images/z0y2eyg.gif

TC bushing is #2. &nbsp;The front of the car is to the left.