The Direction of Auto Concepts

[240 2NR]

I would like to talk/debate/argue over something related to cars that isn't about the Sr vs KA, or JDM vs USDM or what is rice.  

Personally I'm having a hard time with the direction of auto design as witnessed at the auto show in January.  Really ,the only concept car that got my attention was the dodge Razor (a small miata sized coupe with around 240 hp).  It was fairly purist, lightweight, and affordable, though I'm sure it will never get built for just those reasons.  Instead SUV's sell in record numbers and concept cars are designed around concepts that have nothing to do with driving.  If there was ever a reason behind our aneimic speed limits, that got to be part of it.  People are too focused on the traits that don't make a good car.  Concept cars shouldn't be designed primarily for other purposes and happen to drive as well.  That's not what I want to share the road with.  Driving ability should be foremost and if it happens to do something else, it's a bonus.

The idea of multitasking on the road is scary.  It's those pople who don't pay attention or who don't drive defensively that become a statistic, and statistics keep our highways strangled by 55mph speed limits.  Doing your makeup, eating breakfast, and talking on cell phones isn't much of an option at 100mph and would truly focus and raise the awareness of drivers on the road.  Too bad that wouldn't get me out of a ticket.  "Sure I was going 100mph officer, but just think of all the dangerous things I wasn't doing."

[adey]

I agree with your ideas of multitasking on the roads and concept cars not emphasizing the driving aspect enough. The importance placed on entertainment -- specifically audio (and these days visual) in the car plays a huge part as well.

In the States, audio and visual stimulation (other than the road in front of you and listening for your tires' audible responses) is too "important" to be left out of the car. I personally think there is nothing more satisfying than listening to your engine as you downshift for the blind turn coming up -- that you're desparately trying to judge as you take it for the first tmie on some desolate canyon road.

But to most americans, they couldn't care less. They're used to comfort and useless amenities (which is why our 240s don't have cup holders) that do nothing but distract from the task at hand. I suppose it's in man's (a nation's) evolution though; as it gets richer, the people get fatter and more accustomed to unneccessary worldly objects... and lose sight of the important and the central in many things.

Whatever. When there finally comes a day where there're not a car on the market without heated seats or a power glass moonroof, I'll put together my own tube frame AE86 or Datsun 510 and reminisce about days past. Or something like that.
Just a sliver of my thoughts.

[240 2NR]

hehe,  That's my friend's plan right now.  He races a 510 and drives the truck that trailors it everyday.  He's getting tired of getting 12mpg and not having any fun while doing it.  It hit him that he has a parts 510, an extra set of coilovers, shocks and like 20 springs for a 510, three rear ends, two ford 2.3 turbos engines and a 1.8 nissan motor.  So at some point this winter he'll have a project car to create a stripped daily driver.

The question is, cram in a 2.3liter turbo monster, or a polished and carbed 1.8 liter in a roomy engine bay.

[uiuc240]

I'd just like to know at which age drivers switch from wanting something that "goes good", to one that "rides good".  I seriously cannot see myself ever allowing myself to own a Crown Vic or a Monte Carlo or anything from Buick or anything resembling an SUV.  But this is not an SUV debate.

This is about DRIVER'S CARS.

Speaking of which, isn't it interesting that BMW's new iDrive system is too complex to be used while actually driving? &nbsp;But did you know you can adjust shocks, steering and brake balance with it??? &nbsp;I had no idea. &nbsp; <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/crazy.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':crazy:'>

And then there's cars like Lexus. &nbsp;They have so much sound insulation you can hear the road or wind. &nbsp;How do you know what's happening down there? &nbsp;How would you even know if something was wrong with your car?

Why are exhausts so quiet? &nbsp;I like mine loud enough that I can hear misfires...and better yet, the overrun on downshifts. &nbsp;I also like to be able to hear and feel the road...gives me security. &nbsp;That's why I don't like driving on my snow tires...they are too mushy and quiet.

I guess that's why we drive sports cars though. &nbsp;But I just can't see why someone would WANT to spend $20k+ for something that they don't love? &nbsp;Like why would you buy a Buick? &nbsp;You wouldn't spend that kind of money on a TV if you didn't LOVE IT. &nbsp;Why buy a car that you know is crap? &nbsp;That is going to be the second most expensive thing you buy in your life, besides your house. &nbsp;Why buy something you don't even like? &nbsp;

I will always be baffled.

Eric

[srJOEYdet]

I think it would be a good idea to det up all the interrior toys located in the front seat to only be available to use when the car is in park.
&nbsp; &nbsp; So lets say the rich soccer mom in her Infinity QX4 is having trouble finding her way to the country club where her husband is, and she is driving around where I go canyon carving. No while she is paying most of her attention to the high tech, non user freindly navagation system that talks to her, she starts to veer into the opposite lane. Some 300 feet around that blind corner, I am driving my 240. Now I am not speeding excesivly, nor driving wrecklessly. I am Downsifting to slow down so I have time to react for anyunexpected conditions of the Corner. Like the unexpected four thousand puond SUV taking up two lanes. Two seconds later, my face is in my steering wheel, and I am over a guard rail on my roof. Navagation lady is still on the road, geting ready to call the auto club. This is to blame on two things. The woman's stupidity for neglecting the privilige of driving, and for her luxary SUV having distractions built into it.
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;The next week, I am in he hospital without my car, which is no longer in production, and her Infinity is out of the shop, in her driveway, just like new. And what has se learned from this? Probably to get her next SUV with a voice activated navagation system.

That is what I am afraid of when I go canyon carving.

[sykikchimp]

I think it's important to remember when looking at concept cars that they are in fact Concept cars. &nbsp;These cars are built soley to explore ideas, and technologies, and how they can be integrated into ACTUAL vehicles. &nbsp;I think we're comming into a whole new age of vehicles with Performance at the forefront.. seriously.. &nbsp;The kind of performance we haven't seen for 5-6 years now in the new car market.. &nbsp;for example, cars to be released soon:

EvoVII (or VIII)
350z
G35c
Skyline
Supra
RSX Type-R
RX-8

Thats a pretty hefty amount of investment capital going into new technologies that revolve around performance. &nbsp;These cars will be Pieced together from a lot of new tecfhnologies that have been built in Concept cars. &nbsp;I personally am GREATLY looking forward to the next 4-5 years of new cars to come.

[transient]

The only new concepts i'm really looking forward to are from toyota. The new MR2, and the RSC are totally awesome.

http://www.toyota.com/html/shop/look_ahead/conceptcar.html

[SaintlyCharBoy]

I find myself marvelling at driver integration, with precise mathematical evaluation of guage placement versus the time required for your eyes to react and adjust to the road. &nbsp;I am, however dumbfounded at the clash between this careful ergonomic engineering and the slush of the stock tach, and the vague feeling in the vast majority of stock suspensions.

it is uplifting to see relatively spartan concepts, that is, cars with simple interior layouts rather than 25 integrated tv's. &nbsp;I like the current trend towards simpler (albeit sometimes harsh) crisper designs; most of which pushing wheels to the very corners of the vehicle, improving stance.

The problem that i still see is that no matter how advanced or stunning a concept is, the final product is being made by a business. &nbsp;This business is, after all, in the business of making money. &nbsp;As such, striking concepts are watered down to be more palatable to the masses. &nbsp;Gone are the simple sharp lines, the taut suspension, and manual transmissions; favored by unoffensive floaty automobiles. &nbsp;Full of slush.

In the end numbers matter most, and, i fear, the current target audiences favor a/c, cup-holders, and power... everything.

It is true that there will always be someone tweaking, tuning or just playing with his/her car. &nbsp;It is for these people that aftermarket parts manufacturers exist. &nbsp;sadly i think that our current mass manufacturers realise this all too well, and build cars accordingly <img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':('>

( neatly folds paper and steps off of soap box)

[DuffMan]

Things are getting better. WRX, RX8, 350Z, S2000, america has real sports cars for sale now that are affordable. Couldn't say that a few years ago. 240HP Altima, 240HP Accord, and a nimble new Mazda 6. Sedans are becoming sportier because all the true, no-sense-of-driving-fun cretins are buying SUVs. Sales are sending auto-makers a message. The Civic Si isn't selling well because its too weak and overweight. Less people are buying bullshit anymore.

Still we could do better. Look at the options availalbe in Europe and Japan (talking new and used, in every price range) and here. Hopefully we will catch up some day.

[sil80]

First off, all non smokers know that our cars have a cup holder. Its just nissan couldnt find a place for both the ash tray and cup holder so they put the asy tray in the cup holders spot.. just take out your ash tray and wow there is the cup holder &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>
I think saintly said it best.. concept performance cars are beautifull and exciting but rarly ever make it to the real world and if they do there usually watered down.
You also have to realize that there is huge number of people that hate cars and dont give a rats ass if it can do 0 to 60 in 4 seconds. They would perfer a better public transit system before ever thinking about a new performance car let alone a normal everyday gas saving car. Car manufactures know this too... But there's still companys like Nissan, mazda, toyota, VW, BMW, subaru and others that continue to make a few kick ass cars in our price range or atleast cars that have potential(sp? its early).
Thats another thing .... price of cars... I love the skyline, M3, 911(list could go on) but damn if I could afford one.. Maybe when im 30 but not now ... Im going know where with that statement &nbsp;<img src="http://www.zilvia.net/f/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

[HippoSleek]

*apologies to Dan Akroyd* Steve, you ignorant slut...

[rant does NOT focus on SUV's] &nbsp;Actually, I think we are really at a turning point in auto design. &nbsp;No longer are we tied to old necessities thanks to new technology. &nbsp;Cameras allow cars w/o rear windows. &nbsp;New lighting technology allows lights to take any shape or size and function (I noticed last week that virtually every car pre-1995 had headlights that were perpendicular to the road). &nbsp;Safety is better than ever and new engine designs are allowing previously unimagined fuel economy and power.

BUT - the average American consumer has a "flaw." &nbsp;He likes his space. &nbsp;He likes big motors and torque that run on cheap gas and require minimal maintance. &nbsp;He likes leather and wood and quiet. &nbsp;He likes a smooth ride and a place to put his coffee while he's stuck in traffic. &nbsp;He wants the same things now that he did 20, 40, or 80 years ago.

Honestly, on the rare occasion that I drive into the office, I understand why someone would want a bit more lux in their car. &nbsp;My car is hardly modified, but it's stiff, and the wheel feed back is harsh, and it is cramped, and you can't see out so good, and there's barely enough room for groceries, etc. &nbsp;-And I don't even have a family or a house. &nbsp;My car is impractical as hell and I realize it 100%. &nbsp;In that way, a sports or sporty car is a burden to own - if not impossible for many.

Rather, people want the power to pass or enough performance to take the turn a bit faster w/o all the drawbacks of my car. &nbsp;Looking at cars today, I think that's exactly where were going. &nbsp;On the one hand, sports cars are sportier than ever. &nbsp;Entries like the z06, S2000, Boxter, 350z, Mr2, and Miata are filling the need for impractical cars. &nbsp;WHile the new Accord, Altima, 6, IS, and 3 series are filling the niche of reasonably priced, performance capable, practical cars.

The years 1975-1995 were a low point in global autos. &nbsp;Emissions, mandated fuel economy, and crash protection led to heavy, underpowered cars. &nbsp;Jeez- the new Altima sports more power than the s14 w/ an SR (which was a very sporty car)! &nbsp;I think the magic is back.

As for the gizmos - they are here to stay. &nbsp;If you sat in traffic for an hour a day, as many americans do, you'd want all the comforts of home - leg room, nice fabrics, nice sound system, fewer outside noises. &nbsp;I'll save the rant about most people never pushing their cars beyond traction control or idiot lights, so why to you need to hear tires or exhaust for another time.