Went to EFI University to learn tuning basics... PICS!

[Nikeboy355]

This last weekend I went to a EFI University to learn the basics of tuning and engine operation...

EFI 101 - Fundamentals of High Performance Engine Tuning Using Aftermarket Electronic Fuel Ignition

was the name of the class and it was 1.5 day at their Temecula, CA location... They have seminars all over the country as well as in a couple of different countries...

The class costs $495 ($50 off if you sign up at least one month early) and was all day Saturday and half of the day on Sunday...

I decided to take this class because I wanted to learn the basics of tuning... I already understood how the engine worked but thought this class would clear up any misconceptions I might have as well as explain to me what it means to change the values in a standalone or piggyback computer system...

The class went over many different subjects including:
1. The four stroke engine cycle
2. Volumetric efficiency
3. Standard and Absolute conditions
4. Air/Fuel ratio
5. Voltage/Resistance/Amperage
6. Pulse width/Duty cycle
7. All the engine sensors
8. Calculating the correct fuel injector size
9. Fuel and Ignition maps
10. How to adjust the fuel and ignition maps
11. What correct combustion is
12. What Horsepower and Torque are and how they are related

and much much more...

The different standalone systems that he had on his computer was FAST, Autronic, AEM EMS, Motec, and Haltec... It was great to see the difference between all of them...

The teacher himself was the head technical support from Haltech and was very knowledgable on all the different engines from NA K series Hondas to Porsches to RBs... He emphasized that tuning is not a "black art" but more of science/math and that if you understand how it works then it really isn't that difficult...

The first day we spent all day in the books going over the definitions of everything and the second day we were on the dyno... So everything he taught us on the first day we would apply on the second and we saw exactly how the changes in the computer made a difference to the motor on the dyno numbers...

We heard pinging, made base fuel and ignition maps, cleaned up the air fuel ratio, and tuned for peak torque through a certain RPM band... The had Motec hooked up to an older 3 series and we just kept doing run after run... He explained how the dyno worked, how we add load, and what the information on the screen meant...

Some of the interesting lessons I learned were:
1. The most important part of tuning is to control the heat within the engine... When the engine gets too hot is when parts break...
2. The fuel map is what controls the air fuel ratio and has little to do with power... Power is made on the ignition map... First you tune the fuel map and then the ignition map...
3. When tuning the ignition map, all you are looking for it peak torque at each load point without any detonation ofcourse... It really is quite simple...
4. Setup of the engine, sensors, and standalone must be perfect... It is the base for a good tune...

The teacher had a "any question is not a bad question" attitude and I asked a ton of questions... After I was done with the class I felt confident in trying to tune my own car... Soon I plan to pick up a standalone and I'll document a before and after on my motor... Before meaning with the stock ECU and after with the standalone...

I highly recommend the class and plan to take their advanced course after I spend a couple of hours on the dyno experimenting myself...

http://www.efi101.com/efi101.html

http://nitinj.com/Images/240SX2/EFI101/IMG_5307.JPG

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[S.ONE.THREE]

Thats cool man, i went to something like that but it was for motorcycles.

[johngriff]

Haha You met matt! He is cool as hell isnt he?

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d2/vonendorphin/Sema/sema22.jpg
matt and i at sema.

Yes. Hence why the AFC is the biggest joke in the "tunning industry". Since it is indirectly affecting the timing map, you cannot tune for hp output, for the most part, you will just worsten the situation.

The advanced class is more playtime than anything. Basic is where its at.

[Fred Allen Burge]

Excellent post, very informative and well written! I want to go to this, I hope they host one closer to Missouri some time.

Fred

[Matt Cramer]

They're very good classes, particulary if you're just learning. But even if you've had a bit of experience with EFI, they'll probably have something new. I got a bit more out of the Advanced class myself - I'd never driven a car on a chassis dyno before, and it was very useful to see the things from the 101 class firsthand. The class I attended used a wild twin turbo 350Z with an HKS F-Con, and Chris Macellaro taught it.

[NemeGuero]

"Fundamentals of High Performance Tuning"

....

and then there's a picture of a civic.

[snatch13]

"Fundamentals of High Performance Tuning"

....

and then there's a picture of a civic.

haha always a hater!

Good post tho! I was thinking about going to that when they had one in mid-January, but I didn't really have the money. Glad to see you got your money's worth.

[blu808]

seems like a great class.

Good post +1

[HalveBlue]

Cool.

I wonder if they have any seminars in Utah or Colorado.

Would definitely be worth checking out.

Thanks for the heads up.

[Frosty_spl]

WOW that is awesome!

I need some hands-on training. Reading forums about how to tune gets boring.

[ManoNegra]

Sweet. I remember hearing about this classes a while back. +1

[Nikeboy355]

Yeah... Matt is a real cool guy and he really knows his stuff...

It's funny you mention SAFC because he was ripping it apart and it made sense... SAFC (and some other piggybacks that work the same way) only adjust the load reading which moves the scale to different area on the fuel and ignition maps... So they are working to see how rich or how lean they need to be but have no control over the ignition table...

And the igntion mapping is where the power is...

Matt also told us that the reason that Dynojets read higher than other dynos is because they were calibrated using motorcylces... But in general the power number doesn't really mean that much... The dyno is more of a tool to gauge changes in the engine...

I learned a lot from the class and a ton more from Matt himself...

[johngriff]

Matt = My inspiration for absolute hatred of the AFC.

So you going to advanced soon? when is it?

[Nikeboy355]

The next class is in February but I think I would rather put the money towards a standalone...

And compare the stock ECU against my tune on the stock motor that is still inside the car...

[IchigoMae]

Do you get a certificate of some sort after the class or do you just come out as a better person.

[Wei240]

awesome post, always wondered about these classes

so which standalone do *you* think is better from what you've seen in the class, there are always people who like one over the other as different as they are...

[KA-T_240]

It would be sweet to do something like that.

Now I have a source that motorcycles are where dynojet cam from. If I remember right, they came from a small town of Belegrade MT. There shop used to be across the street from where my dad worked. They mostly just did carbs on motorcylces back in the day.

[redsuns3838]

+1 for the only constructive post in chat for a while

[Nikeboy355]

For tuning we only used the Motec and I really liked how easy it was... The lambda meter was built into the main screen so you don't have to look away from the monitor as you do the run... That is while tuning the air fuel ratio...

All of the other standalones were actually pretty similar... just they used different values for the same measurements... Like mm instead of inches...

I am probably going to end up with AEM because of the online support, the AEM training course that I can go to, the power of the processor itself, and that I want to be familiar with a system that a lot of people have...

[DrtyRat]

just curious....would this class be for someone w/absolutely no knowledge about tuning(DrtyRat raises hand to indicate that would be him), are would you have to have some basic knowledge first?

[RanciD]

just curious....would this class be for someone w/absolutely no knowledge about tuning(DrtyRat raises hand to indicate that would be him), are would you have to have some basic knowledge first?

You should check out the link he posted to their site, it has a lot of information about the program. From their FAQ:

I'd like to learn how to tune fuel injection, but I don't have any experience. Should I attend EFI U?
Yes! We find that younger students thoroughly enjoy our classes and have an easy time learning new concepts since they have not already been filled with inaccurate pre-conceived notions about how to tune an engine. We regularly see 16-17 year old students in our classes.

Sounds like you'd be fine. :)

[reactor]

I also attended EFI 101 class on 1-27 and 1-28 in Redmond, WA. Awesome class, we had Ben for our teacher. Can't wait for the advanced class to come up here!

[Silverbullet]

shit thats an expensive ass class.. What do you get at the end? is there some type of cert?

There are books at the book store if you guys are just want the knowledge.

[DrtyRat]

I'd like to learn how to tune fuel injection, but I don't have any experience. Should I attend EFI U?
Yes! We find that younger students thoroughly enjoy our classes and have an easy time learning new concepts since they have not already been filled with inaccurate pre-conceived notions about how to tune an engine. We regularly see 16-17 year old students in our classes.



Sounds like you'd be fine. :)
Except I'm 31....:(:(:(:(
Do those books at the book store provide info in a manner in which some like myself could comprehend?

[SochBAT]

I think you'd be better off with the class than the book.

Hands On teaching compared to reading something you might not be able to conceive, and can't ask questions.

[pablo180]

Nikeboy355 +1 for an informative post. Sounds like a cool seminar to attend.

There's a class strictly dedicated to the topics you mentioned at Cal State Northridge. The reason I mention this is because the book for it is awesome and should be in any serious tuners library.

Internal Combustion Engine Fundamentals by John Benjamin Heywood. It comes in at about $100 and is very technical but a bargain for someone looking to expand their knowledge about engine behaviors.

[boosteds13]

Sounds interesting... It would be nice to have the confidence that I won't blow my engine apart. I play with Live Edit a lot for my own rom tunes on my motor. I was thinking about picking up a romulator so I can make changes on the fly on a dyno. For those who don't know about the Live Edit/Romulator tuning, here's a screenshot--

http://www.escic.com/240sx/timing1.jpg

[johngriff]

LINKSSSS to live edit please.

Heat plus too much timing "blows" engines. So, tune the timing map at a dyno. Given you have access to a data log-able wideband currently.

[O3DigitalBath]

AFC is the biggest joke in the "tunning industry". Since it is indirectly affecting the timing map, you cannot tune for hp output, for the most part, you will just worsten the situation.


slightly off topic, but can someone explain this a lil more? Pretty sure I get the gist of it but still lil confused.

[boosteds13]

slightly off topic, but can someone explain this a lil more? Pretty sure I get the gist of it but still lil confused.

The AFC lies to the ecu about the amount of air entering the engine. The ECU uses airflow and RPM to determine a total theoretical pulsewidth (ie: load on the engine). Using some formula, it determines a spot on the fuel and timing map. Well, the less air coming into the motor, the more timing advance is given to the engine and less fuel. As everyone knows, more timing + less fuel = detonation city.

[johngriff]

http://www.zilvia.net/f/showthread.php?p=1077578#post1077578

[O3DigitalBath]

^thanks :)

very nice explination

[civicsi2]

nikeboy sounds like you learn a bit more than i did. I took one last march. was worth the money. Just wish we spent some more time going a bit more indept. but overall i learn alot. the best thing is i know the truth instead of listening to retards on forums. that and i tuned my own car (ka-t with aem) to 240hp on 8psi. i'd like to take the advanced class but for the money i rather keep messing with my own car and learn that way.

remember, afr doesn't affect HP

Have over want, BITCHES