Keep The SR or Go KA-T?

[cc4usmc]

I currently have a blacktop SR but im think of switching to KA-T because i will be stationed in SoCal (Camp Pendleton to be exact) at the end of the year. If it weren't for Cali's gay emissions i'd keep it. Now i want to know what you guys think. Keep the SR, or go KA-T? I'd also like to know the reasoning behind your answer. I know KA-T isn't legal either, but its easier to fix then an SR if a cop was to pop my hood and go :nono: . I'd rather not hear a bunch of "dont drive like an idiot and that wont have a reson to pull you over" etc. I just want to be prepared. Thanks Guys!

[tre]

I currently have a blacktop SR but im think of switching to KA-T because i will be stationed in SoCal (Camp Pendleton to be exact) at the end of the year. If it weren't for Cali's gay emissions i'd keep it. Now i want to know what you guys think. Keep the SR, or go KA-T? I know KA-T isn't legal either, but its easier to fix then an SR.


Greddy makes a Smog passing turbo kit for the KA

[cc4usmc]

Greddy makes a Smog passing turbo kit for the KA


I emailed Greddy a little more then a month ago and they said that the kit is still pending in California. I have also read the same thing on a number of other threads.

[aznpoopy]

that kit has been pending certification forever.
drop in a LS1. problem solved.

[Cashizslick]

Register your car out of state.



Problem solved.

[Jefferson]

damn I was thinking the same thingas the two post above
Either register your car in another state, or if you have money to spend on swapping and turboing a KA why not just swap in an LS1 and be done with all your problems

[tre]

both will be pains int he ass, dont do it. get a ticket mailed to that adress. You not mail it in in 15 days. Get pulled over and hauled off to jail? I wouldnt want to.

LS-1 Will throw off the weight distribution HORRIBLY in the car.

BUT it is up to you.

[Cashizslick]

both will be pains int he ass, dont do it. get a ticket mailed to that adress. You not mail it in in 15 days. Get pulled over and hauled off to jail? I wouldnt want to.

Who said he was gonna get tickets???


Reg it out of state somewhere. Then have the post office re-direct your mail to ur Cali Address.

[undesiredshoe]

i read somewhere, i think it was the V8 faq, that the ls1 is lighter than the ka

[aznpoopy]

LS-1 Will throw off the weight distribution HORRIBLY in the car.


i don't think it's as bad as most people assume. remember the LS1 may be bigger, but its an aluminum block. the ka24 is iron...

supposedly longblock + mani, flywheel, acc, etc weights look like this

sr ~ 330 lbs
ka ~ 370 lbs
ls ~ 390 lbs

admittedly its hard as hell to get accurate weights off the net though. you never know who is doing the weighing and whether the engine is drained, parts are off, etc.

[StuckeyPCS]

both will be pains int he ass, dont do it. get a ticket mailed to that adress. You not mail it in in 15 days. Get pulled over and hauled off to jail? I wouldnt want to.

LS-1 Will throw off the weight distribution HORRIBLY in the car.

BUT it is up to you.


I hate to disagree with yout, but someone already measured the all aluminum block of an LS-1 motor compared to a ka24de and found the LS1 to be slightly lighter if not only a few more pounds over weight. relocate the battery to the trunk and problem solved.

[ryangreg]

All this talk of swapping a V8 into an S chassis makes me sick to my stomach
:kiss:

[OMGWTFBBQ]

depends if you want your car to run or not.....
haha jk
i've ridden in both sr and ka-t 240's and liked the ka-t better personally, just felt better and was pretty fast
I'd say it would depend on how you want to use the setup though

[tre]

I hate to disagree with yout, but someone already measured the all aluminum block of an LS-1 motor compared to a ka24de and found the LS1 to be slightly lighter if not only a few more pounds over weight. relocate the battery to the trunk and problem solved.


why not keep it a nissan wiht the new aluminum v6/v8 blocks? and TT em? :)

[mmdb]

cc4usmc, I've met a handful of guys in SOCAL with SR20 swaps. A few of them either live in fear of getting pulled over, have gotten pulled over and had their car impounded, and/or sold their cars due to these reasons. Largely those who've gotten their car impounded was due to doing stupid things like speeding, racing, etc. to have this happen. Modding a KA and adding a turbo is also illegal, but having an SR is a red flag. It has never qualified to a legal motor to be run on the highway so I highly doubt cops will give you any sort of break if they see it... much much less than than a KA-T in my opinion.

[aznpoopy]

the newer nissan engines haven't been out long enough. i.e. not alot of them on ebay, in junkyards, etc.

[tre]

how about this keep your car registered wherever its at or "home" is and since you're stationed in Cali. Keep your old plates. You'll have no problems whatsoever with "illegal" swap since you're car's not registered in cali.

[ms!3]

man that must be hard for you guys. inspection places dont care about anything here. you could have an sr20 and nobody would know and even if they did they wouldnt care. when you get your car inspected they just scrape the sticker off and put a new one on. and ive never heard of a cop popping your hood to see if your engine is legal or not. but anyways i would go with a Ka-t, lots of torque and a stronger block.

[fliprayzin240sx]

You got PM...just shiet that we do out up in norcali if our home state starts spazzing bout us not being there physically. I got a boy whos cars been registered in 3 states since hes been out of GA cuz GA requires a safety inspection every 2 years. He couldnt be there to get the car inspected so he had to register it in the states that he was stationed. Told him to register it to TN and havent had an issue. $30 every year thru the mail and they dont need to see your car or do they require you to have a TN address

[ManoNegra]

Been driving SR powered cars in Socal for a few years now. I used to drive stupid but since wrecking two of them I have slowed down quite a bit. Never had an issue with cops (knock on wood) but have had them pull next to me on the freeway or tail me for blocks. Everytime something like this happens, I shit bricks. Next car will be a KAT... I have friends in other states aswell, I have to look into that option. But it's true, the SR scene isn't as mellow and chill as it used to be and I'm getting tired of it. If it's not the cops then it's worrying about thieves.

[cc4usmc]

that kit has been pending certification forever.
drop in a LS1. problem solved.

If i only had 12k!

As for everyone else that replied or PM'd me thanks a lot! I got more then i expected. My car is already registered in WA so i dont think i will have to worry about that for a little while. I just didn't know if the whole "if the car is registered out of state they can't do anything" rumor was true. i was just thinking that the sr isn't just illegal the cali but the u.s., so why would it matter right where its registered?

[ManoNegra]

I have a friend that has Arizona plates. Been stopped a couple of times by a cop for speeding (not too much above limit). Once he got away with a warning, the other he got a ticket. Didn't get sweat for the SR though.

[fliprayzin240sx]

They can still pull you over all they want, just no point of them impounding your car since the car is out of their jursidiction. They might give you some BS ticket bout smog and shit, but that wont stick in court cuz duhy...its registered out of state and they cant prove that your car wont pass smog, they cant force you to get it smogged either...

[jdm_s14_zenki]

i have an sr. hoods been popped by cops 6 times in about a year. unless ur sr is crazy modified (shiny parts in engine bay) u wont get impounded, unless ur being a dick to the cops. also, depending on where ur located matters alot (im in orange county).anyways, in those 6 inspections by cops, all 6 cops did NOT know that i had an SR20det. but i did have an oil catch can, boost controller, and AFC that they saw, and they nailed me 2x for those items (state referee referrals) you dont HAVE to go to the referree and have them inspect it. better yet, file for an extension on the ticket, go to court on that date, they will charge you anywhere from $400-$600 for the ticket, pay it in payments. and you're done. keep in mind that ive done this 2x already. The other 4 cops were cool and let me go. I also got caught going 120mph comming home from Vegas, cop didnt not pop my hood, just wrote me up for 100mph and let me go (i had an s14.5 with a s14 blacktop at that time)

[ellisonrox]

So what we're all essentially saying is that there IS a good advantage in having it registered in another state, for example, Arizona?

Or is it even worth the hassle, even if you could use an address there?

[cc4usmc]

haha...damm...no top mount then i guess... =P

[fliprayzin240sx]

Zenki is right...it also depends on who popped you. Wut sucks tho, CHP knows their shiet. Theyre trained and i got popped by a CHP back in frisko a while back. They walked back to my car after they asked me to pop my hood with a nice lil book with pictures of stock engine bays. Yah 240s are in there, they know wut a stock KA looks like. Cop was being koo tho since i didnt really do anything (plus i always give them my Military ID on top of my license and reg). I got pulled for cuz they heard me "chirp" my wheels. Kinda hard not to do it when you got a 2 way diff and a freakin 6 puck UNSPRUNG ACT EXTREME clutch and your sitting on a hill with the cops right behind you. They were just like so we know its not stock...blah blah blah. ill just give you a warning and TRY to get your car to comply with cali regs. Nothing we can really do to your car since its not registered in cali. Then all of a sudden they were like so how much power you think your putting down? Im like "eh?" He was like, just curious...i said iono, havent gotten it tuned...maybe 300 to the wheels. Hes like koo, only thing is try to take your tints off (running 5% all around) and try to get a quieter exhaust, most other cops will pull you over just for that. It wont stick in court but its still a hassle so just letting you know. Then they let me go...

[aznpoopy]

If i only had 12k!


$12k! no way man. more like $5-6k :bigok:

http://forums.freshalloy.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Board=UBB27&Number=68052346

but... since you have a sr already and your car is registered in WA, i would just leave it the way it is. keep the exterior stock looking and don't speed. bet you'll be fine.

[cc4usmc]

Damn...i hope if i run into any cops they are like ^. i just need to get into the track scene...drifting or autocross. im just kinda lost as to how up here in wa, plus i have a busy schedule.

[cc4usmc]

$12k! no way man. more like $5-6k :bigok:

http://forums.freshalloy.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Board=UBB27&Number=68052346

but... since you have a sr already and your car is registered in WA, i would just leave it the way it is. keep the exterior stock looking and don't speed. bet you'll be fine.

damn! well another tread i was looking at, the one where the ls1 is in the FD, the total cost was like 12k. does that price include the motor? shit...if i get in trouble wit hthe sr i will sell it and go ls1. or...i could sell my sr..then i'd be halfway there. but i don't know anone who can weld...

[cc4usmc]

what about 1jz? is that still not legal? i have seen the other threads but i cant find the one that talked about California regs on swaps. i swore i saved it as a favorite bud i dunno what happend to it.

[ManoNegra]

^ I'm no expert but the 1jz you hear about being swapped into 240s are the jdm ones not the ones we got here hence they won't be smog legal. Forget the details. I'm sure Aaron can chime in. :)

[BigVinnie]

Heres my 2 cents and why.
If you are going KA-t build it right. Using cheap and affordable Altima/Xterra/frontier KA pistons drops the compression to 9.2:1, and these ringlands are thicker than the 240sx piston ring lands. This means higher boosting and more power, without the worry of frying rings.
You also live in cali, KA's are abundant at wrecking yards with parts (ecu's, heads, etc) gallore.
After market support is becoming better for the KA.
Hell obviously you were SR, now maybe it's time to get some low end torque youve never felt before. Torque band on the KA is much smoother and linear, thatsa great thing since you just have to shift a tad earlier than the SR.
Might as well let the V8 guy's feel your 2.4litre turbo charged WRATH....
Just my 2 cents....

[cc4usmc]

i would never put in cheap parts. if i want ka-t it would be rebuilt using rebuild kit ams240 offers, but it would be the complete one here

http://www.amsperformance.com/store/product_info.php?cPath=24_62&products_id=303

i just found a s14 ka-t for sale in my area and i want it. no i have to see if i can get enough for my car since he doesn't want to trade...

[Id-]

both will be pains int he ass, dont do it. get a ticket mailed to that adress. You not mail it in in 15 days. Get pulled over and hauled off to jail? I wouldnt want to.

LS-1 Will throw off the weight distribution HORRIBLY in the car.

BUT it is up to you.


Yeah it will throw it off HORRIBLY on the car. It weighs less than the KA and has the same length and sits lower in the engine bay. Man thats horrible.

Research your facts before you make uninformed comments.

[Id-]

^ I'm no expert but the 1jz you hear about being swapped into 240s are the jdm ones not the ones we got here hence they won't be smog legal. Forget the details. I'm sure Aaron can chime in. :)

There are several 1jz swaps here in the states. Garageworks iirc has done one. Pretty slick. Cheaper, stronger, more plentiful and more powerful in stock form than the RB25. Also has a higher power potential. Its a 2jz with a shorter stroke (same rods, same pistons, different crank, block deck height is just shorter)

[cc4usmc]

There are several 1jz swaps here in the states. Garageworks iirc has done one. Pretty slick. Cheaper, stronger, more plentiful and more powerful in stock form than the RB25. Also has a higher power potential. Its a 2jz with a shorter stroke (same rods, same pistons, different crank, block deck height is just shorter)


hmmm...so is it a legal swap or not?

[Neejay]

i don't think it's as bad as most people assume. remember the LS1 may be bigger, but its an aluminum block. the ka24 is iron...

supposedly longblock + mani, flywheel, acc, etc weights look like this

sr ~ 330 lbs
ka ~ 370 lbs
ls ~ 390 lbs

QUOTE:
Weights:
KA with Auto, Cat and accessories = 596 lbs.
LS1 w/ T56, headers, and accessories = 468 lbs

That's right folks. The iron block four cylinder is 128 pounds heavier than the aluminum LS1!

[NemeGuero]

If you don't want to do a lot of work, don't get a KA-T.

[Neejay]

QUOTE:
Weights:
KA with Auto, Cat and accessories = 596 lbs.
LS1 w/ T56, headers, and accessories = 468 lbs

That's right folks. The iron block four cylinder is 128 pounds heavier than the aluminum LS1! /QUOTE

[fliprayzin240sx]

I always thought its illegal to swap engines from another car make into another? Or is it legal as long as the engine is newer than the chassis and has all the smog equipment?

[dannyboi]

I currently have a blacktop SR but im think of switching to KA-T because i will be stationed in SoCal (Camp Pendleton to be exact) at the end of the year. If it weren't for Cali's gay emissions i'd keep it. Now i want to know what you guys think. Keep the SR, or go KA-T? I'd also like to know the reasoning behind your answer. I know KA-T isn't legal either, but its easier to fix then an SR if a cop was to pop my hood and go :nono: . I'd rather not hear a bunch of "dont drive like an idiot and that wont have a reson to pull you over" etc. I just want to be prepared. Thanks Guys!

Tell the police you are fighting for this country and that you can do whatever the fuck you want. :2f2f:

[aznpoopy]

Weights:
KA with Auto, Cat and accessories = 596 lbs.
LS1 w/ T56, headers, and accessories = 468 lbs

That's right folks. The iron block four cylinder is 128 pounds heavier than the aluminum LS1!

that misleading

KA with auto = auto tranny still attached? vs. a LS1 with no trans? its probably more like 510 and 470.

still i agree the 'weight problem' is really people just making up excuses to hate the LS without any real info. a difference of 30 or 40 lbs is not a big deal

[EchoOfSilence]

I always thought its illegal to swap engines from another car make into another? Or is it legal as long as the engine is newer than the chassis and has all the smog equipment?
That's correct. as long as the motor is newer than the car and it passes legal smog, the BAR ref will pass it. RX-7 guys have had their v8's legalized already

KA with auto = auto tranny still attached? vs. a LS1 with no trans? its probably more like 510 and 470.

dude... it says with T56. That's the tranny code.

[aznpoopy]

lmao

well i learned something new today :)

[Neejay]

lmao

well i learned something new today :)
Yeah, what he said (T56) LOL :)

[ALTRNTV]

KA-T for the win, even though I'm going for SR. :bigok:

[Neejay]

KA-T for the win, even though I'm going for SR. :bigok:
LIES!............

[fatalfury64]

what is the big deal with LS1? it ain't a genuine Nissan engine. would anyone call their 240 a Nissan anymore with an LS1 in it? Just my opinion.

[redsuns3838]

like u said, both are illegal, both with get u screwed if they pop ur hood, and neither will pass visual checks at a smog station...
if u get a ref ticket just go pay the fine. thres some threads on here about what to do if u get a ref ticket. read up on em if u can find em.

i wouldnt worry about getting ur hood popped. if a cop finds out ur in the marine corps i doubt hes gonna treat u like a little punk off the street, HOPEFULLY hed have more respect than that.

but its true if you dont drive crazy, theres not much to worry about.
.

[BigVinnie]

like u said, both are illegal, both with get u screwed if they pop ur hood, and neither will pass visual checks at a smog station...
if u get a ref ticket just go pay the fine. thres some threads on here about what to do if u get a ref ticket. read up on em if u can find em.

i wouldnt worry about getting ur hood popped. if a cop finds out ur in the marine corps i doubt hes gonna treat u like a little punk off the street, HOPEFULLY hed have more respect than that.

but its true if you dont drive crazy, theres not much to worry about.
.


Ref ticket and pay fine?
Thats only half of the problem. The other problem is having the car upto date on proper EPA/DOT regulations. If the car isn't fixed it can be impounded and sold at auction...... Some cars that are confiscated now in CALI are a manditory 30day impound if the officer feels that your car isn't safe for street driving.

[Jung918]

if a cop finds out ur in the marine corps i doubt hes gonna treat u like a little punk off the street, HOPEFULLY hed have more respect than that.
.

Most of the local cops don't really care if your a Marine or not.

[fliprayzin240sx]

Most cops dont like marines unless theyre prior marines...

But anyways thats another point. Keep your out of state plates. Any plates is better than california plates thats for sure. Non-cali plates...no cali jurisdiction period. They can try to force you to pay fines or wut not but they cant do shiet to your car period.

[EchoOfSilence]

what is the big deal with LS1? it ain't a genuine Nissan engine. would anyone call their 240 a Nissan anymore with an LS1 in it? Just my opinion.
who gives a shit if you can't call a 240 a 'Nissan.' It was still made by them, right?


This isn't a car to be a purist about. It's all about personal preference.

[Id-]

what is the big deal with LS1? it ain't a genuine Nissan engine. would anyone call their 240 a Nissan anymore with an LS1 in it? Just my opinion.

It has HUGE aftermarket; can make far more power than the SR or KA can; especially on pumpgas.

400whp and 400ft-lbs of torque with a HUGE powerband and tons of torque off the line is doable with a simple intake manifold, cam swap, and head porting. Drivability, gas mileage, responsiveness, etc... the list goes on. The swap is legal, provided the engine is swapped into an older car (not hard since most LS1s are 1998+)

The transmission won't shit a brick when you go to higher power levels either. The Tremec T56 is HUGE. Weighs double the KA tranny.

The 1jz isnt a legal swap either. It has no provisions for EGR, etc. It was never available in a USDM vehicle.

[Slo S14]

So let me get this straight, a drifter uses an Ls1 so all of the sudden its the new fad?:keke:

[BigVinnie]

This isn't a car to be a purist about. It's all about personal preference.


Well not to argue but to some people it is about being a purist. As for me I've owned nothing but Nissans. Owned a Datsun 510, 240sx, hardbody, and then a 2004 frontier. Some people just like the nestalgia and respect that comes with the badges and logo's that comes with the vehicle, and then again there are those that don't give a fuck....
Half the people that buy Nissans don't even know that they built the kamikazi fighter jets that fought against us in world war 2.... So to some they don't know enough about where or who our own enemies were.
I'm a purist because I respect the technology that comes with Nissan. I respect chevy because they build great powerful trucks at an affordable price, thats about it....

[EchoOfSilence]

Actually, it was Mitsubishi that built the Zeros.

Anyway... don't get me wrong; I like what Nissan used to be, and Nissan later may be great. But I do believe there are better manufacturers out there. I say that this car isn't one to be a purist about because it doesn't have as extensive of a history as other cars do (although it does have some race history). Instead, most of its background is based around its use in a sport where anything goes.

Give me a 510, a 240z, a Skyline, an M3, a Porsche..... etc. Those are better candidates, in my opinion, to be a purist about (if you'd like).

However we're going off on another tangent.


I like both motors, however I've never been in a nicely running tuned KA-T (Evan :keke:)

[BigVinnie]

400whp and 400ft-lbs of torque with a HUGE powerband and tons of torque off the line is doable with a simple intake manifold, cam swap, and head porting.

What huge power band, the rev and redline is about as consistent as the KA's on boost. It will drop out before 7000RPM. Now if you talk about the z06 vette Ls7 now you have an engine that far surpasses the power band of the sr on any level with a higher peaking redline as well. LS1 is small potatoes as far as rev and redline is concerned.

[BigVinnie]

Actually, it was Mitsubishi that built the Zeros.




Read the history of prince motors/Nissan
http://zhome.com/History/Truth/Prince.htm

[tre]

^^ lol wtf?

anyways we all know renault now owns half of nissan haha

[Neejay]

So let me get this straight, a drifter uses an Ls1 so all of the sudden its the new fad?:keke:
WTF are you talking about?

[Slo S14]

WTF are you talking about?

This is just the last place I thought I'd ever hear speak positive words about ANYTHING domestic, especially a GM

[EchoOfSilence]

they're not all that bad. this isn't hondatech

[EchoOfSilence]

Read the history of prince motors/Nissan
http://zhome.com/History/Truth/Prince.htm
everything being done before everyone merged to become prince? I would hardly call that wholly Nissan.

"Although the Nakajima Tsurigis were the purpose-built kamikaze planes with no landing gear, Zeros were also used.The Navy ordered two prototypes and plans were submitted by Nakajima and Mitsubishi. Nakajima elected to drop their proposal for a fighter design and Mitsubishi submitted their design led by designer Jiro Horikoshi. While flight testing the A6M1, a new power plant passed its Navy acceptance tests, and the 925 hp Nakajima NK1C Sakae 12 was installed in the third A6M2 prototype. Mitsubishi alone produced 3,879 aircraft of this type, Nakajima built 6,215 which, together with the 844 trainer and floatplane variants produced by Sasebo, Hitachi and Nakajima, brought the grand total of A6M series aircraft to 10,938."

Sorry for the mixup, I guess we were both right.

[Slo S14]

Lol, I wanted a 99-01 Z28 / TA / Formula but insurance would've kicked me squa in the nuts

[BigVinnie]

Sorry for the mixup, I guess we were both right.

Good arguement we both learned something.....+6 for you playa....
I like it when some one really knows there shit.......

[cc4usmc]

Well i have some good news and bad news. The bad news is i blew my bb t28 on my sr. the good news is i bought a 96 240sx se with a ka-t for 6k. it has a piston ring piston ring, but for the size of the turbo the motor should/needs to be rebuilt anyways. now....do i toss the ka but use the turbo for my sr, or sell the sr and rebuild the ka?

[jdm_s14_zenki]

cheapest route would be to swap in the SR. swap turbos. best way is to rebuild the KA with pistons rods, bearings, ect. sell the SR, and that should pay for most of the rebuild depending on what hook ups you got.

Let me know if u need hookups :]

[cc4usmc]

cheapest route would be to swap in the SR. swap turbos. best way is to rebuild the KA with pistons rods, bearings, ect. sell the SR, and that should pay for most of the rebuild depending on what hook ups you got.

Let me know if u need hookups :]


i wanted to go ka-t to try something new, plus i am moving to cali and a ka-t is easier to fix then an sr. but i like the sr because of the :yum: factor. i like when you go to a local car show and you pop your hood and you get a group of people standing around your car. i haven't gotten in to drifting yet because of a busy schedule so but i don't consider myself a ricer or a poser. you will NEVER see anything cheap put into my car. no APC seats and an underglow kit here:keke: . but i went off subject. i was already looking into rebuilding the ka but that would take too long.

what kinda hookups are you talkin about:naughty:

[Neejay]

i wanted to go ka-t to try something new, plus i am moving to cali and a ka-t is easier to fix then an sr. but i like the sr because of the :yum: factor. i like when you go to a local car show and you pop your hood and you get a group of people standing around your car. i haven't gotten in to drifting yet because of a busy schedule so but i don't consider myself a ricer or a poser. you will NEVER see anything cheap put into my car. no APC seats and an underglow kit here:keke: . but i went off subject. i was already looking into rebuilding the ka but that would take too long.

what kinda hookups are you talkin about:naughty:
I think KA-T would have more of an effect on people now over SR, unless you're trying to impress the "majority" (as in people who don't know much about nissans/cars). Hell, go KA-T and polish/paint your valve cover any color :)

[cc4usmc]

lol... i really don't car about the guys that don't know what they are looking at. Its the guys that do know what they are talking about and can tell me that i did a good job or its really clean etc. Im not really a "shiny metal everywhere" kinda guy. Im more about good parts and a clean setup.

[jdm_s14_zenki]

i like being a sleeper. here in cali, people dont oooo ahhhhhh SRs anymore. 2 years ago they did though. I'd much rather see a KA-t much more then SR. IMO

[BigVinnie]

i like being a sleeper. here in cali, people dont oooo ahhhhhh SRs anymore. 2 years ago they did though. I'd much rather see a KA-t much more then SR. IMO

Being from Cali myself, I don't care for the SR. It has been proven numerous times that with a proper ecu tune the KA makes more power with less boost than the SR. Both engines make PEAK power at about 5600RPM anyways, SR just drags a loss in power longer. Technically if you shift at 7000RPM when peak power dropped at 5600RPM, it just decreases the chances of a better 1/4mile time.
KA needs to be shifted earlier, and there are no problems since it makes a crap load of low torque to compromise it's drop in power early in the power band. Literally I hear guy's skirt and chirp there tires in 4th gear when boosted nicely on the KA.

[jdm_s14_zenki]

ive chirped my s14 sr to 4th...KA = higher compression?, thus, lower boost = more power then SR with same boost #s. but of course KA= bigger displacement. when i had my toda exhaust cam advanced 5 degrees i got 260whp and 260 tq (stock turbo at 14psi) no ems or anything except afc. full torque at 3500 rpm, power climbing all the way to 6800 not bad for a stock turbo. Of course the head is fully built but thats for reliablity more then anything.

But again, you dont have to spend that much on an SR to get same power as Ka-t. but KA-t is of course badass and cast iron block is bullet proof.

[BigVinnie]

But again, you dont have to spend that much on an SR to get same power as Ka-t. but KA-t is of course badass and cast iron block is bullet proof.


The KA is also a siamesed block which means it has larger than normal coolant passages for a 4 banger to decrease heat. Regardless of heat properties cast iron only becomes stronger as it is reheated. KA blocks are pretty indestructable, the internals just need a tad bit of work.....

[jdm_s14_zenki]

i think im gonna go buy a KA and build it. then keep the SR as backup. This sounds too tempting!

[Neejay]

i like being a sleeper. here in cali, people dont oooo ahhhhhh SRs anymore. 2 years ago they did though. I'd much rather see a KA-t much more then SR. IMO
Exactly my point :)

[Neejay]

Being from Cali myself, I don't care for the SR. It has been proven numerous times that with a proper ecu tune the KA makes more power with less boost than the SR. Both engines make PEAK power at about 5600RPM anyways, SR just drags a loss in power longer. Technically if you shift at 7000RPM when peak power dropped at 5600RPM, it just decreases the chances of a better 1/4mile time.
KA needs to be shifted earlier, and there are no problems since it makes a crap load of low torque to compromise it's drop in power early in the power band. Literally I hear guy's skirt and chirp there tires in 4th gear when boosted nicely on the KA.
Again, exactly my point :)

[cc4usmc]

well you guys have me convinced that keeping the ka is best. i went out to seatle to pick up the s14 and i had planned on getting close to home using the ferry. the damn car is too low so the only way to get it back way drive. now the guy that i bought it from said that it had a blown piston ring and that the engine smoked. well i drove it close to 70 miles, maybe more, and there was no smoke at all. what i did notice was a lot of back fire, no power at the higher gears. now a friend of mine thinks that the problem might be that the isn't enough fuel being pumped. we don't know what size injectors are on the car...well....as a matter of fact we dont know a lot about what the car has. the guy i bought it from says is has tocikio(?) shocks and eibach springs, but its sits wayy to low for that. im mean..the cars got 19" wheels and they are tucked under the fender. the only other thing that we can think of are cut springs., but i was told that if you cut springs the car would be bouncey, which its wasn't. i guess i will find out tomorrow when i pull of the wheels. wish me luck guys...coilovers woud be sweet!

[Neejay]

Make sure to do a leakdown and/or compression test on it.

[mmdb]

Glad you picked up the KA. I'm sure you'll enjoy the benefits of having .4 motor liters (turbo spooling faster, torque). Post pix of it when you get the chance.

[cc4usmc]

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g11/cc4usmc3/100_2386Small.jpg

[cc4usmc]

thats my new ride guys...i know it needs a lot of work...those wheels have to go!

[Neejay]

Heres my 2 cents and why.
If you are going KA-t build it right. Using cheap and affordable Altima/Xterra/frontier KA pistons drops the compression to 9.2:1, and these ringlands are thicker than the 240sx piston ring lands. This means higher boosting and more power, without the worry of frying rings.
What years correspond to those model cars?

[Neejay]

thats my new ride guys...i know it needs a lot of work...those wheels have to go!
Take some more pics (during the day). I just think the wheels need a different offset maybe? Not sure until daytime pics :)

[cc4usmc]

yeah the offset is pretty bad...the tires are thin ass hell to.. i know this is still a night time pic but i dont have a daytime one..

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g11/cc4usmc3/100_2400Small.jpg

[shawn_16]

did you get it running?
i haven't touched my mine yet
electrical thing is ticking me off!

[cc4usmc]

did you get it running?
i haven't touched my mine yet
electrical thing is ticking me off!


yeah shawn it was running like 10 minutes after you left. jeff and me went for a ride....we actually hit boost hard...jeff lost traction in second even with the poor running engine and 19's

[m072514]

i hope to be in a similar situation as you (USMC with PCS to MCAS miramar with 3rd MAW) in a few years...

KA-T would be an easier fix in cali than SR, i suppose.

[SR20d2fourT]

Take a look at your situation. If it really calls for changing it and you really dont want to be messing w/ the law then do what you think would be easier. I live in Texas and they dont give a shit :D:D:D:D haha, right now Im running open dump daily (lmao) cuz I dont have money. So yeah, do what you need man, whatever you find easier and less expensive.

[j00ni3]

if you have money to spend like that... i would've went with a all N/A setup... which idk if you prefer it .. but get some really good internals.... spend couple of grand on the internals... starting with the crank ( balanced and knifed ) with new pistons, rods, cams, lifts, retainers, ) from what i heard on a diff forum from BIGV that with the nismo crank pistons and rods the ka can actually achieve 10k rpm with no load ( now idk if a sr can do that :naughty:)
and rev higher than a sr with load

and as soon your bullet proofed the engine... do the exhaust and the intakes... get a new head or get it machined.. then just get a good ecu tune...


if you have money to spare you can prolly make a good 300hp to the crank even more (of course not with just what i listed, prolly more to it... im still studying )

and the GREAT part about it is that it will last WAYYYYYYYY longer than a turbo...( not much rebuilding of the block and turbo itself )

and also solves your problem.... from cops it will just look like a reg ka24... but they don't know the rest that's been tuned and transformed... and you don't need boost gauges for this... so it saves you all the headaches while giving your more of a torque curve than an sr...

and you will have the nice power band also of a N/A~ ( no boost lag ) hehe...

just my .o2

[BigVinnie]

from what i heard on a diff forum from BIGV that with the nismo crank pistons and rods the ka can actually achieve 10k rpm with no load ( now idk if a sr can do that :naughty:)
and rev higher than a sr with load



True, but that NISMO bottom assembly cost over $8000, I don't think anyone is buying it any time soon in the near future.

[fatalfury64]

You guys make very good arguments. I would go ka-t if i had the money for the turbo and to lower the compression.

[NemeGuero]

True, but that NISMO bottom assembly cost over $8000, I don't think anyone is buying it any time soon in the near future.

I'll buy one after my next check... when I'm 30. HAHA

[cc4usmc]

well i just have to find out whats wrong with my new ka-t. im probably gonna have to do a complete rebuild, but i wonde how far i need to take it. i know i will need new rods,pistons and rings....but what do i nee dto do to the block and head themselves?

[NemeGuero]

Buy another stock KA, slap the bitch in its place and boost away.

[cc4usmc]

i wish it were that easy but its a huge turbo. im talking 600whp. haha..crazy! at least i can say i didn't buy the turbo. i have been think about putting it one a running engine and just turing the boost down looooooww, then saving so i can make it bombproof. then i can boost away =P

[BigVinnie]

You can find moderately low mileage blocks for around $300 to $900.
I would get the engine up and running, then I would do a rebuild in the process with forged internals, low compression pistons, knife edged crank, crank scraper and windage tray. Then swap one in for the other.

If you chose to do DSM ecu swap with sensor and CAS, then you can make upto 420WHP on stock internals and some 660cc injectors with the KA, ABEL racing has already done it. If not do what Evan is doing and do the Biki ROM, it will make you think a whole lot different about the KA and it's potential.....

[EchoOfSilence]

And tell me, what are you going to be doing with '600whp'

[NemeGuero]

And tell me, what are you going to be doing with '600whp'

I vote... "dying"

[Neejay]

You can find moderately low mileage blocks for around $300 to $900.
I would get the engine up and running, then I would do a rebuild in the process with forged internals, low compression pistons, knife edged crank, crank scraper and windage tray. Then swap one in for the other.

If you chose to do DSM ecu swap with sensor and CAS, then you can make upto 420WHP on stock internals and some 660cc injectors with the KA, ABEL racing has already done it. If not do what Evan is doing and do the Biki ROM, it will make you think a whole lot different about the KA and it's potential.....
I tried searching for the DSM ECU, but all I found was this thread: http://www.ka-t.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3319&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=dsm+ecu+install which really didn't explain. How hard is this? Or do you know another link with info about it?

[cc4usmc]

And tell me, what are you going to be doing with '600whp'


well like i said, i didn't put the turbo on, i never said i was gonna use it to full potential. but..i will most likely swith it out for something smaller...because i vote to live.

[BigVinnie]

I tried searching for the DSM ECU, but all I found was this thread: http://www.ka-t.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3319&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=dsm+ecu+install which really didn't explain. How hard is this? Or do you know another link with info about it?


I've never done the swap myself, but it is achievable. Put the parts list together and you can get them off of any newer 4 banger Mitsubishi's that ran a turbo at a wrecking yard for around $300.
You can P.M elks240 he defenitely can give you more indepth info on how it is done, and how you would want your basic setup. The wiring set up is a tad introcate, but it's a pretty badass system since its main functionm is wideband instead of narrowband.....

[cc4usmc]

Buy another stock KA, slap the bitch in its place and boost away.


should i buy a later ka motor, one that is obd1? i'd have to get the ecu too right? and what about the harness?

[NemeGuero]

No sir, the blocks are identical.. well nearly.. but identical enough.

All you gotta do is use ANY dohc head and block.
Just be aware the s13 dohc uses different cams than the s14.

[cc4usmc]

No sir, the blocks are identical.. well nearly.. but identical enough.

All you gotta do is use ANY dohc head and block.
Just be aware the s13 dohc uses different cams than the s14.


so let me get this straight...i can use an s13 ka block and head, but i should keep the cams from the s14? what about the s14 harness...will it work with the s13 ka?

[NemeGuero]

The harness doesn't attach to anything on the block/head.. the harness attaches to all the little accessories bolted on to those parts. So keep the manifolds you have now, but swap out the head/block together.

And actually, you can get better flow using the s13 cams. They have 240/248 or something like that and s14 is 232/232.

So put the s13 exhaust (248) on your intake side, and the s13 intake on your exhaust side.. but make sure you align them properly at TDC.

[EchoOfSilence]

wtf? i didn't know of this switching intake and exhaust cams. I thought the s14 guys just used the exhaust s13 cam

[NemeGuero]

You can do both.. in fact, most people do use both..
Go on www.ka-t.org and you'll see a lot of them using both; or Big Vinnie can tell you more about it.

[cc4usmc]

The harness doesn't attach to anything on the block/head.. the harness attaches to all the little accessories bolted on to those parts. So keep the manifolds you have now, but swap out the head/block together.

And actually, you can get better flow using the s13 cams. They have 240/248 or something like that and s14 is 232/232.

So put the s13 exhaust (248) on your intake side, and the s13 intake on your exhaust side.. but make sure you align them properly at TDC.


but i thought that one had an external coil and one didn't? thats what i was told, but maybe i misunderstood. if thats not true...you just saved me a bunch of money:w00t: :faint:

[NemeGuero]

Yes, s14s have internal coil, s13s have external.

But you can swap distributors, they're just bolted to the front upper timing cover.

[cc4usmc]

Yes, s14s have internal coil, s13s have external.

But you can swap distributors, they're just bolted to the front upper timing cover.


is that swap covered on ka-t.org? i'd look but im not even supposed to be on the internet. my GySgt would squash me like a bug! :hammer:

[BigVinnie]

The problem with getting an s13 OBD1 block is that they all have relatively high mileage. The OBD1 blocks IMO are a better setup for boosted application. The cams come stock 240/248 the overlap is set pretty well. I would leave the cam set up the way it is, it was designed to pull some mad lowend torque. The fact that the ecu is more than likely OBD2(s14) there won't need to be any use of the secondary butterfly's that came stock on the OBD1 intake manifolds. This would allow for some really good throttle responce and a better high end margin in power to remove the SCV's, or just us ethe s14 KA manifold on teh OBD1 KA s13 block.
The 240/248 setup is very comparitive to OBD CA18det cam set ups the overlap is almost identical. Cams were almost the same with the same overlap since they used pretty close to the same rod stroke ratio. Using the 248 on the exhaust as if it were stock instead of using it as the intake will allow for an increased spool time. I would defenitely do this instead of the 232/232 setup that comes stock on all OBD2 KA (s14). , or 248/232 setup. Besides in order to properly set the 248 exhaust cam you need to invest into a JWT adjustable timing sprocket and retard the cam about 1~2 degress to make proper overlap with the s14 exhaust cam 232. Or even if using a 248/240 cam set up, but now you would need to tinker with 2 adjustable timing gears adn now advance the intake cam on the exhaust side about 1~2degress. Alot of hassle using hot cam swaps IMO.

[NemeGuero]

Speak of the Devil and he chimes in..

Vince, I thougth you said the 248/240 was a better setup for me? And this is the first I've heard about the adjustable cam gear.. damn. But people get away without using the adjustable cam gear? 'cuz the people I talk to with the hot cams.. don't have them.

[BigVinnie]

Speak of the Devil and he chimes in..

Vince, I thougth you said the 248/240 was a better setup for me?

248/240 is better for you, fine tuned it makes alot more power, we discussed that cam gears would be needed, and you already use the bikirom to set the MAPS.
People for torquey low and mid end do 240/248.It's just as good of a power achiever for people that don't want to spend alot of money on tuning, if time is money. I was just mentioning that this one was better because it's just an affordable alternative that makes really good power.
I was just speaking in the sence of relative eas which is better in making power, they both make power one is just EASIER to do....



'cuz the people I talk to with the hot cams.. don't have them.

Well the people that you are talking to are possibly pulling your chain. the position that the 248 is positioned on the 4 tooth method actually opens the valve lift at .005 TDC. The cam makes better power pulled back into the stroke and retarded about 1~2degress.
I did discuss that this cam would infact need to be timed and after all we did each drink a pitcher of beer to our heads......

[NemeGuero]

I did discuss that this cam would infact need to be timed and after all we did each drink a pitcher of beer to our heads......

I guess this is what did it in.
Damn, well thanks for clearing it up. Guess I won't be installing this cam till I get some adjustable cam gears.. weak.

[BigVinnie]

LOL it's all good man, I'm not a very good speaker when I'm faded...
Probably my bad for not clarifying, but I will do the 248/240 on my NA since they already come in my OBD1 engine, cam gears will cost me $300 with some tuning........

[NemeGuero]

You're confusing me now.. 248/240 OR 240/248??!

[infinitexsound]

i hate threads like these, some people just dont have any brains to figure out for themselves....

[BigVinnie]

You're confusing me now.. 248/240 OR 240/248??!


CAM GEARS needed for 248/240....... 240/248 is set perfect.........

[NemeGuero]

Ok, don't I want 248/240? Do I need cam gears? Which set up is better under which conditions?

[cc4usmc]

i hate threads like these, some people just dont have any brains to figure out for themselves....


then stay out:down:

[JMixedDS13M]

wow nice thread. one of the best i've read so far... so much good info!!!!!!!

[infam0us44]

Thank God I live in Florida.
No Emission.

[BigVinnie]

Ok, don't I want 248/240? Do I need cam gears? Which set up is better under which conditions?


You wanted more peak HP and a better midrange so the 248/240 would work better for you. You need a cam gear for the 248 in order to maximize power. The curve drops a tad early because it isn't positioned right on the INT. side...

[NemeGuero]

Only an adjustable gear for the intake side? The exhaust side is fine?

But I like low end..

[BigVinnie]

You would technically need one for exhaust too, it just isn't as imporant, and you can get away without using one on the exhaust side.
You still get plenty of torque with this setup, the KA is a stroker engine. It will allow for peak power to be a tad bit better on the linear side so that it doesn't top out at the regular 5600RPM. Using the smaller duration cams like the 232's will allow the power band to drop early, but it will make a substantial torque band, HP wont drag out as long. If you like to much low end you are sacrificing the engine to top out early in it's RPM range.

[vinhnumber]

whats wrong with n/a?

[NemeGuero]

whats wrong with n/a?

He speaks the truth..

Vince, we gotta chill and discuss this some more in detail..

[BigVinnie]

Vince, we gotta chill and discuss this some more in detail..

Yeah defenitely. I'll find some time this week to chill and let you know indepth what I am presenting.
Also along the lines of the BikiROM I found out that it isn't wise to use a Cali ecu. So now I am looking around for a FED issued ecu, something about conflictions with the EGR purging if I do this more aggresive tune that I planned on (it will throw codes 32 and fuck up my tune). So now it looks as if I'm gonna need 2 ecu's anyway, one for smog and one for my biki.......
Since your outta Berkeley for a while we need to get some serious tuning done.

[NemeGuero]

Yah we do.. Bill sent me some stuff on ignition tuning so we have our work cut out for us.

Lets make some killer KAs.

Oh, I'll be in Vegas 24-30.

[S14DB]

I'm just going to get a set of 264's

[ranger240]

All this talk of swapping a V8 into an S chassis makes me sick to my stomach
:kiss:


thats what people did to the old 240z's long before s13s came out.. the more i thinka it... it sounds better tehn dealing with alllllllllllll the problems of getting a ka-t to run right... ls1's are admittingly more expensive and would probably cost more to swap in then a e to de swap, but once youve got it in and running it'll surely be a hell of a lot more reliable then any somewhat legal turbo setup out there...