It's official: the U.S.-market GT-R will be a Nissan

[exitspeed]

Nissan Motor's President and CEO Carlos Ghosn announced today at the New York Auto Show that the new GT-R supercar will be sold in North America as a Nissan model, and not under the Infiniti brand as previously rumored.

The production version of the GT-R will debut at the Tokyo Motor Show in 2007, with its launch in the Japanese market scheduled for Fall 2007. The U.S. launch will follow in Spring 2008.

Thanks to Josh and Jason for the tip!

http://www.autoblog.com/2006/04/12/its-official-the-u-s-spec-gt-r-will-be-a-nissan/





This doesn't suprise me at all. I'm glad it went this way personally.:hsdance:

[atom]

I could give a crap about the name itself, but it would have been better if it were an Infiniti if only for the better service you get at Infiniti dealerships. I can't imagine plopping down 60k+ or whatever the new GT-R is gonna cost and having to deal with run of the mill Nissan service.

[OptionZero]

interesting

i thought they were gonna make the GT-R an infiniti and give nissan a pumped up Z as well

[exitspeed]

interesting

i thought they were gonna make the GT-R an infiniti and give nissan a pumped up Z as well

Wow, I never heard that one...:confused:

From what I understood the only question was whether it would be an Infinity or a Nissan. The more I think about it the happier I am. I'm glad they are not comprimising the heritage of the name.

[FRpilot]

what are the specs on this proposed car? weight, power, etc?

[OptionZero]

it was on the FA forums

[NemeGuero]

There have been rumors of a TT 350Z.. since its predecessor was TT...

I hope so..

[kY.gordon]

I would like to see that TT 350z.

+1 for japanese super cars

[ALTRNTV]

Woot for the Nissan badge!

[Igor]

sweet news !, but some reason, im still in love with older nissans....

[exitspeed]

it was on the FA forums

Hmm...I'm not on there...

Now that they've commited to making the GTR a Nissan, I would put to rest any thought's a a TT 350z from Nissan. No way could they have a 350z and a G35 at $35kish, a TT version at $40k+, and then a GTR at $60+. Just too much. I wonder what that means for the S-Chassis (Urge I guess) predessesor? We'll see I guess.

[OptionZero]

the rumor was the 350Z TT coming in *above* the "infiniti GTR" by being priced at 85k or so as a highly limited variant, with the GTR in the 60-70 range as the regular production supercar to fight the 911, Supra

no idea how that will play out now

[exitspeed]

the rumor was the 350Z TT coming in *above* the "infiniti GTR" by being priced at 85k or so as a highly limited variant, with the GTR in the 60-70 range as the regular production supercar to fight the 911, Supra

no idea how that will play out now

Like I said with this announcment I'd put a rest to that rumor...:-/

[NemeGuero]

85k for a 350TT? It better be a pretty amazing car for all of that.

[koukidough]

Yes I knew it'll be a Nissan. Go Nissan!

[m072514]

i actually wished it would come here as an infiniti. to compete with the other marques will take name recognition, especially amongst those who dont know the heritage. the service and brand name are obviously better at infiniti dealerships. and i know for a fact that the cars get f*cked with at nissan dealerships. im not so sure about infiniti.

hopefully, this will bring nissan more upmarket and let the engineers concentrate on sport over luxury.

[exitspeed]

hopefully, this will bring nissan more upmarket and let the engineers concentrate on sport over luxury.


I think you hit the nail on the head. The GTR is first and foremost a true firebreathing sports car. it's not a luxury car by any stretch of the imagination. If it was brought here as an Infiniti, buyers may have a misconception that it's going to have heated seats, automatic climate control, room for more then one prostitute etc. So your right. They can focus on what's important with the GTR. Hopefully this can change the image of Nissan all together. I know that's what their thinking.

Wise move Nissan...wise move.

[Ricks15]

Now a even bigger reason to buy one:keke: gota start saving up.

[monkey7]

I wonder if they are going to stick with a RB series motor? Or would they stick a enhanced version of the vq35?

[SilviaNinja240]

pretty sure its the vq

[Ricks15]

is it going to be VQ twin turbo or that unanounced V8twin turbo

[ThatGuy]

RB has been out of the picture for awhile now. VQ is the new Nissan powerhouse.

[603240sx]

this is what it said in super street 4/06 pg 42. ...in an unbelievable move ,nissan just announced that they will release the r35 skyline gtr in april"07 .powered by a turbocharged 4-cylinder. word has it that they are in negotiations with honda to buy up their leftover stock b and h-series motors.whoneeds the extra weight that two extra cylinders carry?

[ALTRNTV]

The flagship of the Nissan fleet will be powered by a 4-cyl? I don't believe so. Also, the rumor about Nissan buying the Honda motors? :keke:

So you go to Shitty Street for your info?

[ThatGuy]

That was the April Issue wasn't it? Don't believe anything from the April Issue. Wait a minute, STOP READING SUPER STREET. It's for wannabe's and Newbs!

[603240sx]

I thought people might wont to here it. I dont beleive shit till I see it. Plus what if I read ss. I all so read sport compact car,modifeid,import tuner,turbo,hci,dsport and grass roots.I learn alot of shit from these magazines.so dont talk shit becuase your on the other side of the country. Some of you need to grow the fuck up.

[ThatGuy]

603240sx, calm down and STFU. I was joking. If you really believe that Nissan is buying up Honda 4 cylinders to put in the new GT-R then you are an idiot. It's a joke. Way to lose your mind and mouth off to the wrong person.

[603240sx]

I Was Not Talking You. Guess What Your Not A Bad Ass So Chil Out.

[ALTRNTV]

If you honestly think the flagship vehicle of Nissan will be powered by 4-cyl B/H series Honda motors.. you don't belong driving a car.

[koukidough]

GT-R will be the flagship car for Nissan, why on earth will they opt for an old b or h series motor from Honda. Those motors have very low torque it probably cant even push the GT-R chassis up a 40 degree angle hill lolz!!! Also think about it....Honda motor running awd hahaha, put your girlfriend on the passenger seat and the gt-r will lose 30% power lol. I have a b16 on my hatch and shit still have problems going uphill.

[Neejay]

Finally! +123456 for Nissan. I can't wait to see these on the streets...

[nismoenthu]

If you honestly think the flagship vehicle of Nissan will be powered by 4-cyl B/H series Honda motors.. you don't belong driving a car.


totally agree!!!

[SochBAT]

IMHO, the GTR concept isn't all that great. As well at the 350z. They should have just revamped the older S30-31 chassis, and made it up to date with all the new dohickies and such. I still don't consider it a 'roadster'

But then again, i'm just me. Go Nissan.

[d*star180]

+654684684643516879861 for it staying a nissan! Infiniti Skyline wouldnt sound right.

[Neejay]

IMHO, the GTR concept isn't all that great. As well at the 350z. They should have just revamped the older S30-31 chassis, and made it up to date with all the new dohickies and such. I still don't consider it a 'roadster'

But then again, i'm just me. Go Nissan.
Wow, I thought I was the only one who didnt like the 350z 100%. And I kinda agree with you on updating the chassis, but nonetheless I still cant wait to see these on the streets.

[TurDz]

IMHO, the GTR concept isn't all that great. As well at the 350z. They should have just revamped the older S30-31 chassis, and made it up to date with all the new dohickies and such. I still don't consider it a 'roadster'

But then again, i'm just me. Go Nissan.


It's still too early to judge the GTR...at least performance-wise. It's still very secretive. I tried it in GT4...decent car, haha.

[ranisron]

2008.... hum... I should be making 80K by then (I better be). May be I could afford the Skyline?

GO NISSAN :bow:

[SimpleS14]

For those calling it a Skyline....well...its simply NOT a Skyline. That's what we have over here at the G35. I can rant on and on about that but meh. :p

Anyways, I think it would have been best to be labeled under the Infiniti brand name in the states. This is because alot of consumers tie a brand name (or badge) to the cost of the car and see it as justified or not. So far the only car I can think of that is priced significantly higher than the other models in the line-up is the Chevy Corvette. But then again that car has history in America, far more than the GT-R.

I'm glad this car is coming to the states, but I'd hate to see it face the same fate as the Volkswagen Phaeton (which is actually a nice car).

[SochBAT]

Darn, you're right.
VeeDUB Phaeton
http://www.in.gr/auto/dokimes/pr_dokimes_ae/foto_big/ae_VW_Phaeton_685_012002_01.jpg

[m072514]

For those calling it a Skyline....well...its simply NOT a Skyline. That's what we have over here at the G35. I can rant on and on about that but meh. :p

Anyways, I think it would have been best to be labeled under the Infiniti brand name in the states. This is because alot of consumers tie a brand name (or badge) to the cost of the car and see it as justified or not. So far the only car I can think of that is priced significantly higher than the other models in the line-up is the Chevy Corvette. But then again that car has history in America, far more than the GT-R.

I'm glad this car is coming to the states, but I'd hate to see it face the same fate as the Volkswagen Phaeton (which is actually a nice car).

right-O, my friend! in fact, chevrolet is considering changing the name "corvette" from a model name to its own brand... and making the different trim levels into the different "models."

what theyre trying to do is have people consider the corvette by itself and not lump it in with the aveo, cobalt, and suburban...

...alot of american rich people who are not "in the know" will not know about the GT-R's rich heritage, and the brand name is more important to them than actual performance. they will most likely lump NISSAN gt-r with NISSAN sentra and NISSAN altima, and stay away.

i like to think that's a GOOD thing...

[HyperTek]

i seriously wonder if this will be a good move for nissan..

[Agamemnon]

...alot of american rich people who are not "in the know" will not know about the GT-R's rich heritage, and the brand name is more important to them than actual performance.
Then let them purchase Infiniti's. People who wanna drop 50k+ and are not interested in performance buy into luxury.

they will most likely lump NISSAN gt-r with NISSAN sentra and NISSAN altima, and stay away.
I disagree. Sports car enthusiasts who are looking to spend anywhere from 50K-75K generally do some research on what they are buying. I have never heard of anyone comparing their R34 GTR to a Nissan Cube, or someone hating their NSX because the same company badge is on a Civic.

Besides, Infinti is already getting a performance inspired luxury car with their new G concept.

[ALTRNTV]

or someone hating their NSX because the same company badge is on a Civic.

Word.

Nissan GT-R. Just like it should be.

[kouki_s14]

who thinks i should sell my car for this thing?
i wish...........

[SimpleS14]

someone hating their NSX because the same company badge is on a Civic.

The car never made it to the states under the Honda badge. Furthermore, i think the next NSX will be under the Acura badge and Lexus will get their own supercar.

But either way, we just have to wait and see what happens. I just hope this is a good move for Nissan, I mean...how many bad moves did they make in the past five years? I can only think of the first Quest and the "tooth" grill.

Maybe this can help to push Nissan more upscale or just focus on sport rather than luxury on the GT-R. But then again....why would your main target be the Porsche 911 Turbo and lack luxury. :/

BAH....whatever...I know I'm going to still buy one. :p

[exitspeed]

Simple14 I see were your coming from and I understaned the American market as far as badging and that goes. The Pheaton (sp) failed 100% because people didn't want to plop down that much money for a VW.

This is fell is slightly different. Though the GTR name is mostly nown by the younger generation here in the states I feel Nissan will do a good job exploiting their racing haritage with cars like the Z for their advertisement's here. I really don't think think that people will think that it's too expensive for what it is. If it was a 300hp $50,000 car that would be one thing. But it's going to be 500hp+ TT, AWD. I don't think their going to have a hard time convincing buyers (that CAN afford it) that it 's a great alternative to the countless Vett's etc that are ont he road.

And i like to reiterate what I said in a previous post. I fell this is a good point.

"I think you hit the nail on the head. The GTR is first and foremost a true firebreathing sports car. it's not a luxury car by any stretch of the imagination. If it was brought here as an Infiniti, buyers may have a misconception that it's going to have heated seats, automatic climate control, room for more then one prostitute etc. So your right. They can focus on what's important with the GTR. Hopefully this can change the image of Nissan all together. I know that's what their thinking."

[Yuri]

I know this probably doesn't make sense to a lot of you, but I had mostly lost interest in the GT-R when I heard that it would be badged as an Infiniti. All I could think is "oh great here's another great car that rocks overseas but is getting comprimised by focus groups of fat-assed americans who don't enjoy driving." As mentioned before, the GTR is a sports car, not a luxury sport tourer. As such I was looking forward to destroying old white guys in their Infiniti GTRs as they fumbled around their golf clubs attempting to find their gear selector, while I pulled away through the corners in my Evo. But now that the GTR is staying truer to its roots, I might end up trading the evo in on a GTR (probably after its been out for a year).
It's amazing how a simple name change can affect things.....

In related news, did anyone hear that VW is changing the name of the Golf back to Rabbit?:wtf:

[exitspeed]

I know this probably doesn't make sense to a lot of you, but I had mostly lost interest in the GT-R when I heard that it would be badged as an Infiniti. All I could think is "oh great here's another great car that rocks overseas but is getting comprimised by focus groups of fat-assed americans who don't enjoy driving." As mentioned before, the GTR is a sports car, not a luxury sport tourer. As such I was looking forward to destroying old white guys in their Infiniti GTRs as they fumbled around their golf clubs attempting to find their gear selector, while I pulled away through the corners in my Evo. But now that the GTR is staying truer to its roots, I might end up trading the evo in on a GTR (probably after its been out for a year).
It's amazing how a simple name change can affect things.....

In related news, did anyone hear that VW is changing the name of the Golf back to Rabbit?:wtf:

Looks like were on the same page...

And yea I heard about the Rabbit name change. I think that should work out well for them actually.:mepoke:

[ThatGuy]

Well "The Fast" is a Rabbit, so why not change the name back with the same advertising campaign.

GT-R should be a Nissan. It'd be like a Ponitac Corvette if not. :barf:

[xtheenderx]

i say screw the gtr and the z's just come out with a US s15 chassis with a turboed KA24DET! lol j/k

[exitspeed]

GT-R should be a Nissan. It'd be like a Ponitac Corvette if not. :barf:

Actually it would be like a Cadillac Corvette. Luxury brand...

[OptionZero]

forget the semantics and what it should be based on histrionics

this car needs to be a seller

where do people buy Infiniti's? At infiniti dealerships
where do people buy Nissans? at Nissan dealerships

presumably there's a difference in quality of service, simply because the clientele is different

would most americans feel comfortable walking into a nissan dealership to buy a GTR for 60k when its the same place where kids go to buy their Sentras? same service place, parts dealer, etc?

[ThatGuy]

I thought about posting that, but isn't XLR-V actually a Cadillac "Corvette"?

[OJmobileII]

I thought about posting that, but isn't XLR-V actually a Cadillac "Corvette"?

its built on a modified c6 chassis and shares some components. but the xlr-v has a 4.4l s/c dohc northstar. not an ls2 or ls7.

would most americans feel comfortable walking into a nissan dealership to buy a GTR for 60k when its the same place where kids go to buy their Sentras? same service place, parts dealer, etc?

people have been buying vettes from the same chevy dealers that people use to buy cavaliers and now buy cobalts. but then again, people r familiar w/ vette.

it is a risk to put the gt-r in a nissan show room, but w/ the way nissan's recently lineup overhaul... i'm sure it will have a better result than when the phaeton was badged a vw.

[exitspeed]

I thought about posting that, but isn't XLR-V actually a Cadillac "Corvette"?


Somewhat. It shares suspension compnents mostly. The rest is different, especially the engine.


OtpionZero...

American's feel comfortable walking into dealers and paying $60k for a New Z06 when they are selling a Cobalt or even worse...and HHR and GM being near bankruptcy.

Or Dodge with a Viper that has a POS Intrepid on the lot.

It's a lil different cause their American brands, but not entirely. Nissan has a sporty presence in America. I don't think it will be an issue. We'll see though. Can't WAIT:naughtyd:

[OptionZero]

the corvette is an american institution

the GTR is an unknown quantity to the people with 60k; the only people who know who it is are the kids who play GT

i think this is a poor BUSINESS decision

whats the point of having infiniti if not to sell 60k nissans

[m072514]

the corvette is an american institution

the GTR is an unknown quantity to the people with 60k; the only people who know who it is are the kids who play GT

i think this is a poor BUSINESS decision

whats the point of having infiniti if not to sell 60k nissans

exactly... besides, the name is less of an issue than saleability. only the gran turismo generation knows what the hell a silvia, fairlady, or skyline is. the people who play gran turismo USUALLY dont have the kind of cheddar to be buying a GT-R... i think its a good idea from a PERFORMANCE perspective to name it nissan, but bad business-wise.

either way, i hope it will be badass.

[exitspeed]

the corvette is an american institution

the GTR is an unknown quantity to the people with 60k; the only people who know who it is are the kids who play GT

i think this is a poor BUSINESS decision

whats the point of having infiniti if not to sell 60k nissans

I wih some big wig from nissan would come on here and give some insite everyone and a while.


I don't think it's a poor business dicision. Like I said we'll all just have to wait and see.

[OptionZero]

I wih some big wig from nissan would come on here and give some insite everyone and a while.


I don't think it's a poor business dicision. Like I said we'll all just have to wait and see.

The reasons i've heard for putting a nissan badge have been "but it's SUPPOSED to be a nissan" or " it's ALWAYS been a nissan"

None of those reasons have any weight from a business perspective in the U.S.

Nissan USA has built a sport reputation on the Z; THAT has heritage, THAT has pomp and circumstance.

The GTR would come in ABOVE the Z.
This undercuts both the purpose of Infiniti and the status of the Z.

You're not losing any customers by making the GTR an infinity because the people who care are the fanboys who aren't going to buy it.

You MAY, however, lose customers by making the GTR a nissan because the American public that DOES buy 60k cars places value on badge and dealer experience.

The guy that decided this might as well be the guy who styled the b15 sentra's ass.

[exitspeed]

The reasons i've heard for putting a nissan badge have been "but it's SUPPOSED to be a nissan" or " it's ALWAYS been a nissan"

None of those reasons have any weight from a business perspective in the U.S.

Nissan USA has built a sport reputation on the Z; THAT has heritage, THAT has pomp and circumstance.

The GTR would come in ABOVE the Z.
This undercuts both the purpose of Infiniti and the status of the Z.

You're not losing any customers by making the GTR an infinity because the people who care are the fanboys who aren't going to buy it.

You MAY, however, lose customers by making the GTR a nissan because the American public that DOES buy 60k cars places value on badge and dealer experience.

The guy that decided this might as well be the guy who styled the b15 sentra's ass.

Only time will tell...

[SimpleS14]

hahaha that is true, only time will tell. I know I'm going to look into buying one after a year or two when its released. I just wonder what the ad campaign will look like in North America. Where's the info that this will have 500+ hp? Are you basing it off how many rumor it will perform like the Z-Tune R34 GT-R at a fraction of the cost?

I hope Nissan atleast limits the production numbers coming to the states, rarity adds value IMO if the overall package is good.

[OptionZero]

no official stats

but the new G-series will have a VQ37DE, so we know that displacement figure is already possible and in production future for Nissan

pretty much 99% sure it'll be a VQxxDETT with refined ATTESSA drivetrain

weight will be an issue, the 350Z is already heavy, with turbo AWD it could be 3600lbs...a corvette z06 is at 3100ish lbs and 500hp for $80k

i'd like them to keep it under 3300lbs but no generation of the GTR has been that up to this point, so...not holding my breath

always the outside shot they'll stick a VHxxDE(t/t) v8 in there, i guess

[exitspeed]

no official stats

but the new G-series will have a VQ37DE, so we know that displacement figure is already possible and in production future for Nissan

pretty much 99% sure it'll be a VQxxDETT with refined ATTESSA drivetrain

weight will be an issue, the 350Z is already heavy, with turbo AWD it could be 3600lbs...a corvette z06 is at 3100ish lbs and 500hp for $80k

i'd like them to keep it under 3300lbs but no generation of the GTR has been that up to this point, so...not holding my breath

always the outside shot they'll stick a VHxxDE(t/t) v8 in there, i guess



Sums it up right there. If you followed alot of the press releases and various tidbits they've pretty much commited to a 500+ car.

[Advan]

If they did bring it over, they'd have to bring a small amount to see how good it does. Otherwise, I see this somewhat being a failure. Like that one perosn said, most people know about the GT-R from GT. As far as selling goes, I hope the price is high, cause the last thing I wanna see is a whole bunch Skylines on the road like Civics/Integras/Accords/Preludes are now. It's always good to see that only one person in in my area of Orlando drives a white R33 Skyline.

Edit: Everytime I see your sig: exitspeed, I keep thinking you're blowing a trumpet(sp), because of the shades.

[koukidough]

Regardless of what badge it is the GT-R is going to sell like hot cakes. I wouldn't be surprised if they had waiting lists. As mentioned earlier, anyone who is spending 50k are most likely doing research. To tell you the truth peeps spending even 5k on a car do research.

[exitspeed]

If they did bring it over, they'd have to bring a small amount to see how good it does. Otherwise, I see this somewhat being a failure. Like that one perosn said, most people know about the GT-R from GT. As far as selling goes, I hope the price is high, cause the last thing I wanna see is a whole bunch Skylines on the road like Civics/Integras/Accords/Preludes are now. It's always good to see that only one person in in my area of Orlando drives a white R33 Skyline.

Edit: Everytime I see your sig: exitspeed, I keep thinking you're blowing a trumpet(sp), because of the shades.

I wouldn't be suprised if you do see alot actually. I actually thought I wouldn't see that many STi's/Evo's and I see tons every day.

There's a good example there guys. Not a $60k car but a car that is pretty pricey and look how well they are selling. And there is no heritage for those cars here. I would expect that same buyer to be the ones buying the new GTR.

[drift freaq]

exactly... besides, the name is less of an issue than saleability. only the gran turismo generation knows what the hell a silvia, fairlady, or skyline is. the people who play gran turismo USUALLY dont have the kind of cheddar to be buying a GT-R... i think its a good idea from a PERFORMANCE perspective to name it nissan, but bad business-wise.

either way, i hope it will be badass.
Hahaha, excuse me? Long before Gran Turismo came out there was the 240z and the whole Z car line and heritage and guess what? Those people heard about the Skyline and the GTR reiteration. Do not fool yourself with the idea that the video game generation is the only generation that would know, people in the automotive community young and old know exactly what the hell a Nissan GTR is.
On to the arguement about people willing to plunk down 60k at a Nissan dealership. Things have changed people. Chalk it up to the Titan and the Armada coming in at the 40-50k range and people buying them Nissan will have no problems putting a 60k car on the showroom floor and getting interested parties.
Times have changed folks and there are a lot of well off disposable income people right now that will pay. Plus do not expect the GTR to be a high volume deal. They will probably only make 10-20k of them in the first year at most.

[floodshark]

Not to mention I'm sure there will be a vicious marketing campaign, also I wouldnt be surprised that although badged as a Nissan these things show up on Infiniti dealer lots as well.

[snatch13]

Hahaha, excuse me? Long before Gran Turismo came out there was the 240z and the whole Z car line and heritage and guess what? Those people heard about the Skyline and the GTR reiteration. Do not fool yourself with the idea that the video game generation is the only generation that would know, people in the automotive community young and old know exactly what the hell a Nissan GTR is.
On to the arguement about people willing to plunk down 60k at a Nissan dealership. Things have changed people. Chalk it up to the Titan and the Armada coming in at the 40-50k range and people buying them Nissan will have no problems putting a 60k car on the showroom floor and getting interested parties.
Times have changed folks and there are a lot of well off disposable income people right now that will pay. Plus do not expect the GTR to be a high volume deal. They will probably only make 10-20k of them in the first year at most.

Exactly... 40-50k isn't as much as it used to be. I thought this car was going to be in the neighborhood of 80-100k?

[OptionZero]

No exact pricing has been announced

drift freaq:
http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/otf0999.html
http://www.automotivearticles.com/123/Nissan_Truck_Sales_Stumble.shtml

Are the Titan/Armada sales leaders in their class?
if the answer is no, then you can't use it as a reason to support the theory that people will buy expensive nissans

again, Infiniti exists for a reason- it was created cuz NISSAN thought they couldn't sell 60k+ nissans

Now of course the test will be time and actual sales, and if we hear about people bitching about nissan dealerships

Infiniti needs a halo car more than Nissan needs a halo car. Nissan USA already has their top of the line 350Z which is gonna get updated pretty soon. What better way to pump up the Infiniti brand than with a GTR to crown the lineup? fuck the kids and fans who think it "has" to be a nissan.

[Advan]

Speaking of Halo car, does Infiniti even have a some what decent, half Halo car? You do have a point about the Sti's and Evo's, exitspeed. I just have that bad feeling about it coming here.

[Yuri]

Are the Titan/Armada sales leaders in their class?
if the answer is no, then you can't use it as a reason to support the theory that people will buy expensive nissans.

OptionZero, I really don't see how you can be using this as an arguement to not badge the GTR as a Nissan. The market buying trucks in that class in the US are much more dyed-in-the-wool american brand loyal customers than the sports car market. Of course there are going to be more good-ol' boys buying fords and chevys than Nissans. Does this mean that everyone wants an american brand truck? of course not! Do people still buy the Titan and Armada? Yes. Just because a vehicle isn't a sales leader in it's class doesn't mean that it can't meet sales goals set by the manufacturer.

Mitsubishi and Subaru have proven that a healthy enthusiest market exists in the US. When the Evo came to the US there were naysayers ridiculing the fact that anyone would pay $30k for a Mitsubishi Lancer. This is amusing now, because according to the automotive press, the Evo is the only car that Mitsubishi is able to sell everyone it makes. You may be underestimating the market for the GTR. The Evo had relatively the same exposure to the market as the GTR has, which is to say exposure through videogames, videos, and magazines. Even without a dedicated marketing campaign, the Evo has managed to do very well. The same buyers who have purchased Evos and STi's have now come farther along in their careers, and most will probably have more disposable income to spend on the GTR. This healthy market should be large enough to support the GTR on it's own, without Nissan having to rely mostly on "image" sales, where people are buying the car to just look good (Percentage of automatic Corvettes sold, people?)
Infiniti relys more on an image/luxury market, and the GTR would be ill-suited to exist mainly as an image car, which it would have to partially become, simply for the fact that the edginess of it's performance would be comprimised to fit into the image that Infiniti would want a luxury sports car in their line to posess.
You have to realize that the playstation market/fanboys aren't going to be kids their whole lives, and that this market includes people well into their thirties at this point.

[exitspeed]

^
Damn, well said. That sums up pretty much what I was thinking.

[drift freaq]

OptionZero, I really don't see how you can be using this as an arguement to not badge the GTR as a Nissan. The market buying trucks in that class in the US are much more dyed-in-the-wool american brand loyal customers than the sports car market. Of course there are going to be more good-ol' boys buying fords and chevys than Nissans. Does this mean that everyone wants an american brand truck? of course not! Do people still buy the Titan and Armada? Yes. Just because a vehicle isn't a sales leader in it's class doesn't mean that it can't meet sales goals set by the manufacturer.

Mitsubishi and Subaru have proven that a healthy enthusiest market exists in the US. When the Evo came to the US there were naysayers ridiculing the fact that anyone would pay $30k for a Mitsubishi Lancer. This is amusing now, because according to the automotive press, the Evo is the only car that Mitsubishi is able to sell everyone it makes. You may be underestimating the market for the GTR. The Evo had relatively the same exposure to the market as the GTR has, which is to say exposure through videogames, videos, and magazines. Even without a dedicated marketing campaign, the Evo has managed to do very well. The same buyers who have purchased Evos and STi's have now come farther along in their careers, and most will probably have more disposable income to spend on the GTR. This healthy market should be large enough to support the GTR on it's own, without Nissan having to rely mostly on "image" sales, where people are buying the car to just look good (Percentage of automatic Corvettes sold, people?)
Infiniti relys more on an image/luxury market, and the GTR would be ill-suited to exist mainly as an image car, which it would have to partially become, simply for the fact that the edginess of it's performance would be comprimised to fit into the image that Infiniti would want a luxury sports car in their line to posess.
You have to realize that the playstation market/fanboys aren't going to be kids their whole lives, and that this market includes people well into their thirties at this point.
well said and a good follow up , I have nothing to add.

[OptionZero]

OptionZero, I really don't see how you can be using this as an arguement to not badge the GTR as a Nissan. The market buying trucks in that class in the US are much more dyed-in-the-wool american brand loyal customers than the sports car market. Of course there are going to be more good-ol' boys buying fords and chevys than Nissans. Does this mean that everyone wants an american brand truck? of course not! Do people still buy the Titan and Armada? Yes. Just because a vehicle isn't a sales leader in it's class doesn't mean that it can't meet sales goals set by the manufacturer.

Mitsubishi and Subaru have proven that a healthy enthusiest market exists in the US. When the Evo came to the US there were naysayers ridiculing the fact that anyone would pay $30k for a Mitsubishi Lancer. This is amusing now, because according to the automotive press, the Evo is the only car that Mitsubishi is able to sell everyone it makes. You may be underestimating the market for the GTR. The Evo had relatively the same exposure to the market as the GTR has, which is to say exposure through videogames, videos, and magazines. Even without a dedicated marketing campaign, the Evo has managed to do very well. The same buyers who have purchased Evos and STi's have now come farther along in their careers, and most will probably have more disposable income to spend on the GTR. This healthy market should be large enough to support the GTR on it's own, without Nissan having to rely mostly on "image" sales, where people are buying the car to just look good (Percentage of automatic Corvettes sold, people?)
Infiniti relys more on an image/luxury market, and the GTR would be ill-suited to exist mainly as an image car, which it would have to partially become, simply for the fact that the edginess of it's performance would be comprimised to fit into the image that Infiniti would want a luxury sports car in their line to posess.
You have to realize that the playstation market/fanboys aren't going to be kids their whole lives, and that this market includes people well into their thirties at this point.

Titan/Armada sales were brought up as an argument supporting Dfreaq's assertion that people will buy a 40-50k Nissan-badged vehicle.
The Titan and Armada haven't grabbed huge market share, and aren't market leaders at all.
What were nissan's sales targets for those trucks? Anyone got a link to that?

The GT-R's performance target is the Porsche 911, it's target market will be the 60-80k sports car (not sports tourer) market. It's competitors will be the Z06, 911 Carrera/Cayman, possibly the 6-series/M6, and a few m3 stragglers
In that market image DOES matter, as does branding, dealership experience, and perceived value. The people that buy 60-90 are not the same people that buy Evo's and STi.s

What is Mitsubishi's lineup outside of the EVO? NOTHING. They are bankrupt and losing money. The Evolution is successfull in the United States DESPITE its badge, and SOLELY because of the Enthusiast market. Subaru's different, they have improved their image by building their reputation for safety and reliability, the STi benefits from this reputation as the "softer" alternative to the EVO, as wella s the good will from the Legacy/outback/Baja/etc.

Nissan's GT-R will not survive on just the Enthusiast market (the ones who place the biggest premium on the GTR name). There are enough enthusiasts these days who can buy a 30k car that the EVO and STi can exist- do you honestly think there are enough enthusiasts out there who can afford a 60-80k car? The playstation generation may have grown up, but they've grown up to be 20-30 yr olds with decent/good first jobs...and with those paychecks they buy S2000s, EVOs, STis, and 350Z's. They do not have the capacity to buy 60-80k sports cars (otherwise they would already have 911's...).

So there are two angles I see it:
-Car freaks who know about the GTR name and reputation and care about performance: can't afford 60-90k car yet, so making it a Nissan to attract them doesn't help

-Rich people who want a sports car for pride/midlife crisis: want image/halo aspect, want good dealer experience, can afford Porsche/BMW/Corvette, so you'd need the Infiniti brand to ensure the class of service they expect, the perceived value they want


Ideal "Nissan GTR" buyer:
Young enough to play GT1-2-3-4, watched Initial D, Best Motoring, Option, reads Super Street so knows the heritage and pride of name, has 60-80k disposable income.

Who fits that mold? A coupla guys who own enough Tap Ex franchises to make it? Maybe some tech industry wiz kids?

The STi/EVO do not sell because of their rep. They sell because they are performance bargains and have NO COMPETITION AT ALL. Subaru/Mitsubishi have effectively CREATED a market here: 4 dr AWD, performance car at 30k.

Until official specs/pricing come out, no one can comment definitively, but to be a successful Nissan GT-R, nissan will have to: shed any concerns about interior quality/build reliability in their other cars and lineup, make the car BEAT the new 911 Carrera in performance, beat the Z06 in perceived build quality, and undercut the pricing on both. that's an uphill battle


Here's another aspect:
The maxima, altima, quest, sentra are all butt-ugly. Does Nissan want the GT-R on the same lot as those lumps of car? it hurts my eyes to drive by a Nissan dealership these days.

The G-series oozes sex. I'd prefer to shop at a dealership that has those parked outside.

[SimpleS14]

Here's another aspect:
The maxima, altima, quest, sentra are all butt-ugly.

I could side with some of your points....but man..the new Altima is nice IMO.

http://img321.imageshack.us/img321/8397/altimawp08008qi.jpg

http://img321.imageshack.us/img321/2112/altimawp68009ou.jpg

[Advan]

Why do we even need GPS/Navigational Systems? I don't know if I could trust one of those things. Something could happen, and next thing you know, you find yourself in the boonies of another state.

[slider2828]

Wow come on guys... The engine will be a FZ37DETT close to 450 horsepower... Pretty final about that. Almost the same as the G37, M37, and probably the 370z. Variable cam, lift, and ignition timing. 4Wheel drive and updated atessa(sp?) steering system. Head will be different compared to the other nissan models, but block is about the same really unknown at this point. All engines that nissan will come out with now after the 2007 models will be FZ blocks, no more VQ's..... Japanese magazine sourced during Tokyo Auto Salon 06 in Jan....

[atom]

Mitsubishi and Subaru have proven that a healthy enthusiest market exists in the US. When the Evo came to the US there were naysayers ridiculing the fact that anyone would pay $30k for a Mitsubishi Lancer. This is amusing now, because according to the automotive press, the Evo is the only car that Mitsubishi is able to sell everyone it makes. You may be underestimating the market for the GTR. The Evo had relatively the same exposure to the market as the GTR has, which is to say exposure through videogames, videos, and magazines. Even without a dedicated marketing campaign, the Evo has managed to do very well. The same buyers who have purchased Evos and STi's have now come farther along in their careers, and most will probably have more disposable income to spend on the GTR. This healthy market should be large enough to support the GTR on it's own, without Nissan having to rely mostly on "image" sales, where people are buying the car to just look good (Percentage of automatic Corvettes sold, people?)
Infiniti relys more on an image/luxury market, and the GTR would be ill-suited to exist mainly as an image car, which it would have to partially become, simply for the fact that the edginess of it's performance would be comprimised to fit into the image that Infiniti would want a luxury sports car in their line to posess.
You have to realize that the playstation market/fanboys aren't going to be kids their whole lives, and that this market includes people well into their thirties at this point.

If you are trying to cater to an enthusiast market, then it won't matter what brand it is. An enthusiast will buy the GTR whether it's a Nissan, Infiniti, or Prince. So what are the pluses and minuses of naming it a Nissan vs. Infiniti for the rest of the people, meaning the more casual sports car buyers? To me the pluses favor naming it an Infiniti. Cover all your bases.

As far as image/luxury, just look at Honda. They've had the RSX, TSX, and NSX on the Acura line and they were barely changed from the foreign counterparts. The NSX is the perfect example. Hop on over to NSXprime and see how many people there actually appreciate the Acura service and consider it a nice thing to have. It's quite a few.

Lastly, it's a given whether it's a Nissan or Infiniti it will be marketed as an upscale sports car.

[exitspeed]

The one thing I would like to add to this (dont have much time) is think of this, OptionZero. If Honda, HONDA, can build the truck of the year in the AMERICAN market. Nissan can build a Z06 fighter.

Honda has shown us that with great design and giving a buyer what they want anything is possible.

[OptionZero]

Nissan is not Honda.

Nissan is still up and coming trying to rebuild their brand.
Honda, as far as I know, has never been in trouble.

Honda has more goodwill credbility with the American public than Nissan, at least IMHO recent times.

For Honda, the badge is an advantage in anything they make.
I am not prepared to believe that is the case for Nissan.


More on Nissan v Infiniti
Case in point (take it as you will)
http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp?section=top&subject=csr&story=csrCsi

Infiniti is 5th best in dealer customer service
Nissan is 30th or so

http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp;jsessionid=OYYUJ1BXL2MAHLAZGIWE2UY?secti on=top&subject=csr&story=csrSsi&referer=&aff=national
Infiniti trounces nissan in sales satisfaction

oddly, Nissan beats Infiniti in "customer retention"

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/nissan.html
"We used to say that we get relatively few complaints about Nissan. We no longer say that. But what's still true is that the complaints we receive are unanimous in their view that Nissan USA runs a disgraceful consumer service operation. The company also has a poor record of dealing with air bag injuries suffered by its customers. And don't even ask how their leasing divison treats customers at the end of their lease."



I don't think making the car a Nissan gained anything; NOT making it an Infiniti more than likely cost the company something.

[SimpleS14]

This may sound weird....but can't Nissan select which dealers can sell the GT-R?

[ThatGuy]

You guys are doing an excellent job of keeping this discussion civil, but I jave to ask... Has either side changed your minds at all? Both sides are presenting good arguments, but I don't see any ground being gained by either side. Just my own observation. Feel free to carry on the discussion, as long as it remains civil.

[exitspeed]

You guys are doing an excellent job of keeping this discussion civil, but I jave to ask... Has either side changed your minds at all? Both sides are presenting good arguments, but I don't see any ground being gained by either side. Just my own observation. Feel free to carry on the discussion, as long as it remains civil.


I don't think so:doh: I see were option Zero is coming from. I agree with him on some points but I think the arguement fairs better with other cars in most cases. I think the GTR has somewhat different curcumstances.

Liek I've said numerous times before, only time will tell how the American market will react to this car. You never know. It's a crap shoot with either name on the car.

[Neejay]

You guys are doing an excellent job of keeping this discussion civil, but I jave to ask... Has either side changed your minds at all? Both sides are presenting good arguments, but I don't see any ground being gained by either side. Just my own observation. Feel free to carry on the discussion, as long as it remains civil.
I agree...this seems to be one of those arguments that certain people will not change their mind on...

[SimpleS14]

Has either side changed your minds at all?

Not until summer 2008....